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[–]IsAStrangeLoop 487 points488 points ago

Man /r/skyrim really hates skyrim

[–]wilshere105 412 points413 points ago

You should see r/diablo

[–]PandaSupreme 232 points233 points ago

/r/masseffect shivers

[–]lesser_panjandrum 26 points27 points ago

At least the hate there is balanced out with a healthy influx of turian cloacae and asari azures.

[–][deleted] 26 points27 points ago

You're thinking of /r/masserect there.

[–]headasplodes 6 points7 points ago

No, there's still plenty of rule 34 stuff in /r/masseffect, it's the reason I unsubbed.

[–]IfYouSeeHerSayHello 4 points5 points ago

I thought you were joking. Somehow, I really did....

[–]cryonine 1 point2 points ago

I don't know what I was expecting.

[–]Bogaragaraga 1 point2 points ago

/r/darksouls is filled with love!

and a little bit of hate, but that's self hate, not hate of the game.

[–]mackpack 63 points64 points ago

/r/diablo seems to hate Blizzard more than the game itself.

edit: Oh, I just visited that subreddit after a month or so. First 4 top posts are complaining about Blizzard.

[–]Shit_Tsunami 12 points13 points ago

[–]cbfw86 55 points56 points ago

diablo deserves it, though.

[–]ChaosPheonix11 50 points51 points ago

Correction--Diablo 3 deserves it. Don't touch the other games.

[–]Jerg 110 points111 points ago

A balance between criticism and praise keeps a video game subreddit from descending into pure raging fanboyism / circlejerk.

[–]KRSFive 18 points19 points ago

Wise words this man does speak

[–]hubay 235 points236 points ago

It's just bullshit nostalgia. What's funny is that a bunch of these are actually pretty solid improvements. Like essential items. Sure, for the sake of realism it might sound cool that you can ruin a quest out of stupidity. But has anyone, EVER, accidentally dropped some artifact and thought "aw, man, that's so cool. I love that the game challenges me like this. I can't wait to load my last savegame and go through the last half hour again" Of course not. You'd just ragequit and bitch about shitty mission design on reddit.

Or classes. I've never, ever picked premade classes, so why would I care that skyrim has none? It's more fun to just create something of my own. And half the factions in morrowind are just different class flavors of the same faction – like the vampire clans that just happen to align to mage/fighter/rogue.

Yeah, it would be cool to have more settlements, more weapon types, and the ability to customize the hell out of your character right out of the box. But mods let you do pretty much all of these things anyways (yeah, I know that's not the same thing, but still). Nearly every other improvement is reducing the headaches I get from dropping items, playing inventory tetris, or wasting 30 lockpicks on a Very Easy because the random number generator's being a bitch. Sure, these might reduce the 'purity' of the game if you come from morrowind, but honestly I love that skyrim lets me focus more on playing the game, which seems like the main reason I got it in the first place.

[–]balathustrius 7 points8 points ago

has anyone, EVER, accidentally dropped some artifact and thought...

Me. I looted and sold the House Dagoth cup on my first play through. I embarked on an epic journey to discover exactly to whom it'd been sold. Took me hours. One of my most memorable in-game experiences to this day.

[–]Aydaanh 39 points40 points ago

Someone who gets it and is going against the circlejerk. I think skyrim is much better than oblivion. Everyone is talking about how much better Oblivion was than Skyrim and the nastalgia is a huge factor of this as you said. These comparisons are biased. As I said before, whenever a new game comes out in a series, everyone talks anout how the old one was so much better than the new one. When the new Elder Scrolls come out, everyone will be talking about how perfect Skyrim was.

[–]CluelessClue 54 points55 points ago

For starters I don't give two shits about the circlejerk, nor do I have any super care about nastalgia. The two games are good, but it depends on what you want from the series that matters. If you're looking for quests, character progression, story, unique zones or just overall a really detailed game... Morrowind wins outright, no questions about it.

However, if you're into visuals, combat, dragons, hirables or just overall far better mechanics then Skyrim is the game you're going to be picking.

Lets face it, Skyrim quests are short and lackluster and the lore is weak in comparison to Morrowind. I think this is partially due to the addition of voice acting. In Morrowind everything about the world was open for you to read. You can't get deep into Skyrim lore unlesss you hunt for books, which don't have that much to say anyways (I've read them). They aren't going to VA everything they had in Morrowind so naturally you cut out all the lore and only voice the quest related stuff. Then the guilds in Skyrim just feel like additional quests while in Morrowind they actually feel like you're joining a guild. Morrowind is also designed so that quests conflict with each other. This opens up the whole choice system without actually giving you that bullshit choice menu that games do now. The world, lore and quests are so rich in Morrowind but... all of this is moot for a person who rather have combat.

It's no question as to which game is more developed in combat. Skyrim is nearly everything we have been wishing for in the series. Morrowind gets so unbearable because of its combat system. Most people can't even go back into Morrowind because of this. I know most of the people in r/gaming debate Morrowind being better even though I know most probably can't bring themselves to replay the game. The mechanics of it were horrendous, though IMO it was the best one in the early 3D stages of gaming (cue nastalgia).

Now other stuff like diseases and whatnot is up in the air. I personally love the detail that Morrowind had with every feature. Having that even more hostile environment was a great experience to me. I beat all the non-random quests in Skyrim and didn't once encounter a disease. Some people like that, I just felt like that was lacking. Skyrim is a very safe world outside of combat, even in combat it's far too easy. I had to mod the shit out of that game to make the world even remotely interesting.

Which leaves mods. At face value Morrowind is much more developed than Skyrim. This is because modding wasn't as popular and compatibility was low. Skyrim on the other hand was built around the idea of modding the game. The world is void of settlements & mobs to make room for player buildings and less than half of the items in the world aren't even usuable, this is to leave room for crafting mods. So yes, at face value Morrowind wins because the design purpose was to make a fantastic open world game, but Skyrim wins because it allows for an even greater game through mods.

As for my opinion :P. I love both, but I admit I grew bored of Skyrim much faster because it's a very short game. Morrowind held my attention through proper quest progression and the fact that I always feel like I have something to do. So I pick Morrowind, which also has fantastic replay value. Skyrim has none of that small replay value for those that like new characters, but the game is designed so you can play everything on your first run.

[–]Aydaanh 1 point2 points ago

Morrowind is great no doubt. Yes skyrim was short in most quest lines, (dawnguards bigger and funner than the normal guild quests, they made improvements, and a few new areas look amazing) but it feels bigger to me with the shere number of places to go, and I still have a lot of things to work on, I'm actually trying to read all the books and get all the shouts again, and I'm constantly creating new characters to try different play styles, like I made a sneak character that was an orc and used two-handed weapons, and a jesus character who only wore robes and used restoration and resurection spells.

Edit: Changed ork to orc

[–]kioni 9 points10 points ago

I think skyrim is much better than oblivion

Anyway, I wouldn't say it's just nostalgia. I still think Morrowind is the better game, though Skyrim comes close and surpasses Morrowind in certain areas. I value the writing and atmosphere of Morrowind. There's so much you can learn about the world and the NPCs that is intriguing, whereas in Skyrim there's not a whole lot going on (though a lot more than Oblivion).

Comparing how many of X is in each game is kind of pointless.

[–]Aydaanh 8 points9 points ago

Morrowind was great to, no doubt about that, the only reason I don't like it more than skyrim is the FUCKING CLIFF RACERS.

[–]georgeguy007 5 points6 points ago

I liked oblivion's quests better. Skyrim improved many things, but its quests are stale.

[–]crackeddagger 2 points3 points ago

I do wish they would at least let us store quest items.

[–]ButtcheeksMagoo 758 points759 points ago

I agree with most of these things but that bullshit of not being able to hit something in Morrowind due to your/their luck/ weapon skill was annoying as hell. I AM RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOU SWINGING MY SWORD IN YOUR FACE.

[–]ruin 273 points274 points ago

On those occasions, the molecules in your weapon didn't interact with the molecules of his face.

[–]PSBlake 112 points113 points ago

Magical universes just have different probabilities at the quantum level.

[–]owarren 4 points5 points ago

I like your explanation best.

[–]cherubthrowaway 2 points3 points ago

So you're saying that every time I killed a cliffracer the schrodinger equations became slightly more precise?

Makes sense to me.

[–]Hightscribe 9 points10 points ago

Quantum physics man!

[–]pianobadger 23 points24 points ago

Yeah, probably because the molecules of his sword, shield, or armor got in the way or you just suck so bad with a sword that you completely whiffed.

[–]Cornbrosia 1 point2 points ago

Would you like another EXTRA BIG ASS TACO!? Now with more MOLECULES!

[–]ZeMoose 62 points63 points ago

The trick is to keep your fatigue bar full. You'll still miss sometimes especially if your skill is low but keeping your fatigue bar full makes things much easier.

[–]Zachel 79 points80 points ago

Oh hell no!

If I am going to keep that full, I won't be jumping around, I take jumping like a maniac any day!

[–]MadMageMC 88 points89 points ago

Actually, jumping around like a maniac, especially in Vivec and Balmora, is how I grew the fatigue bar to a usable size. Plus, jumping was faster than walking, so I jumped goddamned everywhere.

[–]UglyStupidLumberjack 24 points25 points ago

Parkour in Balmora was one of my favorite things. Another thing better about Morrowind: acrobatics. I used to jump everywhere I went. Not only was it faster, but it leveled you up. Once you got 100 acrobatics, you could easily vault over someone.

[–]MadMageMC 2 points3 points ago

This is actually something I really miss in Skyrim. I could still do it (mostly) in Oblivion, though it still just wasn't the same.

[–]cherubthrowaway 2 points3 points ago

You could make fortify acrobatics 100 spells in addition to your 100 acrobatics and jump from Balmora to halfway across the map.

Can't do anything like that in Skyrim or Oblivion.

[–]applesforadam 38 points39 points ago

Athletics +1

[–]savenor 89 points90 points ago

Acrobatics was actually the stat associated with jumping. Athletics was for running and swimming.

[–]applesforadam 22 points23 points ago

It's been a while :(

[–]savenor 30 points31 points ago

it's coo.

i used to put a heavy object on my W key and run into a wall for hours and level up my Athletics. good times!

[–]econymous 21 points22 points ago

This is why Morrowind is better

[–]Zachel 10 points11 points ago

Funny you.should mention that, this is exactly what I was doing not 10 minutes ago.

Jumping around vivec that is.

[–]Mooseheaded 2 points3 points ago

Jumping everywhere? Bitch please, I levitated everywhere super fast:

  • Boots of Blinding Speed - cast a 1 second, 100% magicka resist spell then equip the boots. Boom, +200% speed without blindness.

  • Exquisite ring, golden saint-enchanted with levitate on equip. (Skyrim also doesn't have levitate!)

Made getting around (especially in Vivec) so much easier.

[–]SquareSoft 3 points4 points ago

For extra jump height nudity was essential.

[–]PyroConnery 6 points7 points ago

Use fatigue as much as you want, make tons of fatigue restoration potions and use those before lockpicking / fighting.

[–]Spazzo965 5 points6 points ago

I personally had a full set of enchanted gear, and my pants were called "Pants of the runner"

Had a constant effect restore fatigue. It was never a problem.

[–]g0_west 3 points4 points ago

But doesn't that mean walking everywhere? IIRC running lowers your fatigue. Even if it doesn't the only way to get somewhere even slightly quickly was to hold W and A (or D) while bunny hopping.

[–]Jeroknite 32 points33 points ago

You know, the main problem I had with that is that hitting stuff in Morrowind had no impact. A hit and a miss "felt" the same. It was hard to tell whether or not I was hitting anything when I first started playing.

[–]MadMageMC 34 points35 points ago

Nothing more embarrassing that just starting out, grabbing a battle axe, and then dying repeatedly to mudcrabs and slaughterfish.

Fucking slaughterfish. ಠ_ಠ

You reeeeaaally had to wager whether or not that chest at the bottom of the pond was worth the effort.

[–]bearodactyl17 4 points5 points ago

I remember this exact thing happening on my first file. My big Orc thought he was so tough, but he just couldn't hit that mudcrab...

[–]YendorianMarmalade 6 points7 points ago

I've fought mudcrabs more fearsome than you!

[–]Hanul14 5 points6 points ago

Well think of it like their armor is taking the blow. So even if you hit, it has no effect because their armor absorbed the blow.

[–]imredditting 4 points5 points ago

I believe what he's saying is that the game didn't make it feel like there was an impact. Even if armor takes the blow, the attack should feel less like a complete whiff.

[–]Constam 1 point2 points ago

Yea, rather than a mod that made it so you hit every time (game-breaking in my opinion), I'd rather have a mod that shows off the crazy kung fu dodging skills of all those npcs apparently avoiding sword strikes at point blank range.

[–]Incredible_Mandible 50 points51 points ago

This always bugged me, especially games like Diablo 2. The target is frozen solid and not moving. It is a huge bug creature that cannot move, even when not frozen. I have a giant two handed sword that if I dropped it, it would probably touch both walls of the room I am standing in because it is so large.

...

swingandamiss

[–]dixiegunsmoke 4 points5 points ago

I've always viewed it not as missing, but failing to cause significant damage. Failing to penetrate, bouncing right of an armor plate, etc.

I think it works better then a dinky iron blade always causing damage to someone in steel armor.

[–]Bashed 0 points1 point ago

You would miss in Diablo 2 because of your opponent's armor. In other words, yes you did hit, but your clumsy swing was deflected off of a thick steel plate. Get some dexterity or items with AR enchantments and maybe you can hold that enormous blade steady enough to hit that small opening in the armor. Welcome to RPGs.

[–]amjh 411 points412 points ago

It's because Morrowind is an RPG game, while oblivion and skyrim are action games with RPG elements.

[–]ButtcheeksMagoo 97 points98 points ago

So if that aspect of the game was taken out it would no longer be an rpg?

[–]amjh 139 points140 points ago

The other way around, the newer games have the player character's stats affect less things because they are more action focused.

[–]SaikoGekido 111 points112 points ago

Aye. RPG (Role-Playing Game) in the truest sense means that the player is taking on the role of a character. There are levels of separation between the character and the player on purpose to help create the feeling of a separate entity. One of these layers of separation are stats.

The easy way to think about it is that a player may have the enemy in their sites, and know how to fight, but if their character doesn't have the proper skill, that means he's untrained and his attacks will be like someone that doesn't know what they're doing.

[–]Nerull 38 points39 points ago

There is no requirement for an RPG to have stats. Many do, but it's still a Role Playing Game if it doesn't. You stated the definition of an RPG early in your post, and then stuck on a bunch of optional arbitrary stuff.

That a game doesn't follow every single convention of a D&D style RPG does not mean it isn't an RPG.

[–]LordCurlyFry 56 points57 points ago

By that description any game where you play an individual is an RPG. Legend of Zelda? You're playing the role of Link. Call of Duty? You're playing the role of some soldier. By definition an RPG is any game where you act out the role of a character while deciding what actions to take. E.g. every Videogame that doesn't explicitly hold your hand. (see: The Stanley Parable)

You're missing the difference between an actual RPG, and the genre of video games known as RPG.What separates video RPGs are stats and personal character development. No, you don't need them to be an RPG in the strictest sense. They don't even need to allow you to make decisions regarding the world.

[–]AKnightAlone 79 points80 points ago

I'm a serious gamer. I love all games, especially in-depth RPGs like Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3. I've been playing CoD for years, ever since I was 9 years old, and I'm 12 now.

[–]Poly_ 19 points20 points ago

There is a mod called better gameplay for morrowind. Basically if you are swinging your weapon infront of an enemy ON the enemy it will always hit.. unless...

Low fatigue? Go fuck yourself. You're to tired to hit the enemy.

Spells? I hope you leveled your schools of magic! Or else spell failure!

Oh, all this works on enemies too.

[–]Mordraken 6 points7 points ago

Because of the graphical restraints at the time you were required to use your imagination, but I always assumed those thrusts attacks were parried, dodged, blocked, glancing blows, or just plain missed.

[–]MotokoKusanagi 4 points5 points ago

Unlikely to be a constant miss if you're using a major skill/weapon type. In fact it should rarely miss if it's a major skill from the start. Trying to level up a weapon type outside of what you have as a major or minor? You're going to miss a lot. Focus on leveling the type of character you want with the intended set weapon type, progress through the game and level up from trainers the types of weapons you want to use later on.

[–]KindOfANerd 8 points9 points ago

Yeah, the constant whiffing is the one thing about Morrowind I can't stand these days. I never got into the modding scene for Morrowind, so it wouldn't surprise me if there were a mod for that. Maybe I'll reinstall it sometime.

[–]someguywhocanfly 23 points24 points ago

Don't really like the quest items and essential NPCs one either. All it means is if you do that accidentally you have to quickload or just not have that quest, or even fuck up the whole story questline.

[–]Mitkebes 9 points10 points ago

It tells you if you kill someone important to the main quest. And even if you do, there is another way to beat the main quest as long as you haven't killed the last dwarf.

[–]ChickenOfDoom 10 points11 points ago

You don't even technically need him; I've seen speedruns where they just went straight to the mountain and used some kind of clever stat manipulation to get around needing protection from the weapons.

[–]CaspianRoach 98 points99 points ago

It means you have to fucking pay attention to quests and what you pick up / get and why. If you fuck up the main storyline it tells you in the game "you've fucked up son" but you can just continue playing like nothing happened.

[–]pianobadger 17 points18 points ago

Yeah, and it was fucking awesome to be able to kill Vivec.

[–]MadMageMC 10 points11 points ago

This is actually what taught me to "keep house" in Morrowind. Lost a certain ring I needed by selling it to some random vendor in a middle of nowhere yurt, and then couldn't ever find which one when I realized I needed the ring to complete a quest. Ended up starting a new game with a new character, despite being close to finishing the main quest line (this wasn't the only reason, but was kind of a final straw sort of thing). On that next play through, I kept EVERYTHING even remotely likely to be used later. Named item? Into the chest you go!

[–]barpidone 50 points51 points ago

It also means it's possible to kill someone who's essential to a quest you have no idea exists yet. While realistic, I can see how it'd anger someone five hours down the line when the random bar patron turns out to be the informant for the Thief's Guild and now you can't join because he was the ONLY INFORMANT IN THE WORLD.

Note: I haven't played Morrowind in years and this is in no way from memory. It's a completely hypothetical scenario.

[–]rockemsockemrobot 61 points62 points ago

Yeah but like the obvious answer is don't randomly kill a bunch of people, which is pretty realistic. Also, the option to have fun by killing a bunch of people is still there, you just quickload afterwards.

[–]arrjayjee 91 points92 points ago

Morrowind lets you fail. Sometimes spectacularly. Skyrim doesn't. A game that doesn't let you fail also removes any feeling of reward for succeeding. You can't win if you can't lose.

[–]rockemsockemrobot 27 points28 points ago

Exactly. Sometimes it's fun to lose, particularly in sandbox type game. If you try to lose and are unable to, you feel like the game's too easy/helping you too much.

[–]pink_ego_box 68 points69 points ago

You're the fucking dragonborn, you eat elder dragons at breakfast and you wield a Daedric weapon, made of ebonite and of essence of evilness. You've killed thousands of bandits and creatures and you're a master of the Thu'um.

...Yet, when you hit an essential NPC, he just bends the knee for a few seconds, and then he's okay.

"With this character's death, the thread of prophecy is severed. Restore a saved game to restore the weave of fate, or persist in the doomed world you have created.",

THAT was the most awesome game over screen ever.

[–]econymous 24 points25 points ago

Not to mention, Nerevar > Dragonborn

[–]ZalRed 7 points8 points ago

Totally. A man born from a slain and betrayed ancient general, who was foretold by a prophecy made from ashland nomad tribes, and had a goddess-forged ring of persuasion. Also his story was responsible for the birth of an entire race. And the disappearance of another race. He had to unite great houses, guilds, and gods to slay his own ancient friend, who tapped the heart of a dead god to gain a cursed, blightful immortality. A friend who still kinda likes you.

Dovahkiin has the soul of a dragon, a creature not original to the TES universe, written in just for the sake of this game. Story mode was short and weak.

[–]Quaeryt 6 points7 points ago

Reincarnated god... or guy who can yell at dragons. Hmm....

[–]omichron 23 points24 points ago

Well yeah, if you run around killing people haphazardly then there should be real consequences to your actions, you can't just go around offing people and expect the entire rest of the world to function flawlessly.

[–]barpidone 12 points13 points ago

Except the consequence to that action is usually a dead-end quest stuck in your journal, instead of an actual consequence like you're a goddamn murderer and nobody wants you working for them.

Either way - unkillable NPCs or broken quest chains - is less than ideal, I think I've been trained to accept the former more than the latter, though.

[–]omichron 7 points8 points ago

There is that consequence. Everyone either reports you to the guards, or you bribe everyone that knows you're a murderer and continue on with your business.

[–]MadMageMC 4 points5 points ago

I found this out the hard way by killing a certain guy in Caldera for smarting off to me before realizing he was critical to completing quests from a couple of different guilds. I was trying to stay in character (playing a hot-headed Nord fighter) and ended up really shafting myself later on.

[–]TooSubtle 3 points4 points ago

So you had that character's experience perfectly then, because the world gave consequences for how he acted!

[–]MadMageMC 3 points4 points ago

Yes, exactly. Sucked for me as the player since I wanted to master every guild, but it fit perfectly with that character's actions. Next time I play trough, I'll make sure not to kill that guy.

[–]g0_west 8 points9 points ago

I'm half and half on this. It means you have to pay attention, but if you've had a long break from the game and you come back you might not remember what certain things are, especially with the way quests are kept track of in Morrowind. It does mean that you don't have stupid shit filling up your inventory like in Oblivion, though. Yes, it's weightless, but it's just clutter. They should really have a "Quest Items" category in your inventory.

[–]ejgs402 297 points298 points ago

SO many rose-colored glasses.

I put hundreds of hours into Morrowind because it was a stellar game, but lord did it have flaws.

Like people have said, sleeping to level up? Needless delay.

Weapon skills? To be clear, I LOVE choice. But talk about balance issues! How many people played a character that focused on SPEARS? And I know maybe two people that DIDN'T use the "always use best attack" option. I do wish Bethesda had worked on balancing the options instead of paring them down. But actually the power attacks are STILL directional attacks with different effects, so... And anybody who doesn't remember how medium armor struggled to create an absolutely worthless niche should play through Morrowind again, let me know how that goes.

The entire thing about skills and classes is bullshit: classes were just pre-selected skill setups. And while I DID prefer Morrowind's Birthsign mechanism--which was also used in the much-reviled Oblivion--Skyrim does have the Stones, which are obviously the heirs to that role.

Anybody who really liked the abstracted combat either hasn't played Morrowind in years, or should probably just be playing a game with a DnD base. Morrowind was an Action-RPG with emphasis on the RPG. Skyrim is an Action-RPG with a pretty equitable balance. It's fine if you've got a preference and it's ok if you don't like Skyrim's handling of combat, but acting like the system change was an obvious downgrade is stupid.

There are MANY things I think Morrowind did better than Skyrim. Setting, factions (including guild progression, with skill requirements, which was irritating but provided a much stronger sense of progression), variety in weapons and armor, the pseudo-fast travel system, story (IMO--and in this I include the option to fuck the story up and take the backpath), among other things. Morrowind is a great game, ten years on. I might even say Morrowind is the better game, in my view. But Morrowind is also ten years old. And if you actually play it instead of just remember it through rose-colored glasses...my god, does it feel dated. The combat feels abstract and floaty given the game's first-person nature (because it IS abstract, it's ALL math and die rolls--which isn't always bad but really did detract from the "action" part of "action-RPG"), the magic is underpowered unless you break the game and then EVERYTHING is broken, the stealth is frankly shit. I didn't mind reading and thought the backstory enhanced the game, but the keyword conversation system, with everyone providing one of two responses on any of a hundred topics, was clunky at best. The variety in weapons and armor was nice but some options were seriously broken (medium armor and spears come to mind). Morrowind was and is a great game but every time someone posts something like this I get the feeling that they haven't actually PLAYED Morrowind in a while.

[–]noking 66 points67 points ago

How many people played a character that focused on SPEARS?

Me, for one. I liked being able to deviate from the limited archetypes. Spears with medium armour happened to be the character I played through Morrowind with.

[–]gethcake 8 points9 points ago

Dat reach and endurance leveling

[–]conkore 7 points8 points ago

Ditto, every time.

[–]MacroPhallus 24 points25 points ago

Ah, a masochist.

[–]conkore 11 points12 points ago

Well, I always play Argonians and an Argonian without a spear is like a wolf without fir.

[–]LogicalDissent 6 points7 points ago

There should be a support group for spear-wielding, medium armor-wearing Argonian players. They took everything from us! T.T

[–]sword_of_the_morning 1 point2 points ago

I was a spear/halberd user as well, but with light armour. The extra reach helped a lot in situations where I was in over my head, plus polearms are badass. I've been disappointed that Bethesda hasn't included them in the later Elder Scrolls games.

[–]ButterMyBiscuit 41 points42 points ago

I disagree with a couple of your points, but a solid post regardless.

[–]IsaacAccount 9 points10 points ago

This is my favorite sort of comment to see. You do your people proud, ButterMyBiscuit.

[–][deleted] ago

[deleted]

[–]ButterMyBiscuit 17 points18 points ago

Well to start, I think that the Morrowind of 2002 was a better game than Skyrim of 2011. Comparing the two now side-by-side is a little weird because of the vast difference 10 years makes in gaming.

it IS abstract, it's ALL math and die rolls--which isn't always bad but really did detract from the "action" part of "action-RPG"

I agree with this statement that it was heavy math and die rolls, but it comes down to a matter of opinion. I liked that Morrowind had so many more skills. I liked the stats. I liked the math and dice rolling. It was an RPG through and through, and that is one of the things I liked best about it. I'm not trying to convince anyone that makes it better than Skyrim's approach, it's just my opinion.

And anybody who doesn't remember how medium armor struggled to create an absolutely worthless niche should play through Morrowind again, let me know how that goes.

I loved that you could do whatever you wanted. Not every strategy SHOULD be equally strong. If you're heavily invested in melee combat, you should be using heavy armor to be most effective. If you're mostly ranged or a caster, light was better. Specializing and focusing in one area will make you stronger than splitting your skill points. Medium armor was for people who wanted to be a jack of all trades. Dart in for a few stabs with a dagger, cast paralyze, dart back and shoot a few arrows. It's not as effective as running in with a Daedric dai-katana and a full suit of ebony armor and raising hell, but so what? I wouldn't expect it to be. It's fun. I should have that option. Why should it be removed because it's not an efficient and deadly build? This is really at the heart of the RPG with action elements vs. action game with RPG elements argument.

I disliked how Skyrim was so streamlined and dumbed down. There were a few very clear cut roles that they pushed you into. The talent trees are what did the pigeon-holing, in my opinion. Some talents in each tree were just so strong that they dictated how you should play.

EDIT: The_A_Drain's comment a few posts down shares a lot of my sentiments.

[–]apollomr 8 points9 points ago

How many people played a character that focused on SPEARS?

I did. Not everyone is worried about whether or not it gives them the most damage or stats. Some people play RPGs because they actually like, you know, roleplaying.

[–]Vaelkyri 1 point2 points ago

Convenience Kills Immerison.

[–]kiron327 1 point2 points ago

Morrowind is flawless and I recently replayed it. It has its problems but that is to be expected from a game with as much depth as Morrowind. There isn't a game out there that blends the fictional aspects of morrowind with political intrigue as well as morrowind does and the story is absolutely flawless down to the most minute detail.

I recently replayed morrowind and couldn't stop playing. I actually can't stand games these days because they lack the realism that older games had. Basically skyrim was dumbed down so that it could be marketed to a larger audience.

In short don't think that everyone is like you. For some people flaws in the story and lack of realism can be more painful than the worst graphics.

Also I get that you had problems with the game mechanics but there isn't a single problem in morrowind that is as bad as the level and loot scaling associated with monsters in skyrim and oblivion. Also you thinking that the stealth is broken is a matter of opinion. To me it was gratifying that I was able to use stealth to get into the vaults of the three great houses.

I can't even read fiction (I read history now instead) anymore because the author's never pay enough attention to detail. There is always some plot hole or contradiction that will break the story or just a lack of depth that makes the whole story seem childish. Morrowind is the exception. They have an entire library in the game and innumerable quests each of which sheds a little bit of light on the world you are entering. The 36 lessons of Vivic, the history of the empire, and the conversations throughout the game with figures of varying importance all of whom have a little bit of light to shed on the overall situation makes Morrowind a masterpiece.

Also you happen to be mistaken about medium armor. The best piece of armor in the game (Ebony Mail) is medium and therefore it is necessary to raise the skill. Also medium armor has its advantages including less weight than heavy and more protection than light. Magic is also extremely useful when used correctly although I will agree that it is underpowered.

Also the dice rolling is a way of working around the limitations of the technology. If you can't have an animation of a character missing or dodging then I'm okay with the character not hitting.

Finally I prefer the skills/abilities set up of morrowind because that means that you have to plan to get maximum statistics. You needs to manipulate the properties of the game in order to maxmize your attributes and its the same with enchantments. This makes the game deeper and more realistic. Having a game where you level the same no matter how you do things is retarded in my opinion.

[–]bobosuda 361 points362 points ago

If I'm not mistaken, Skyrim does have different attacking types based on movement direction.

And I really don't see the point in listing Morrowind as having 27 skills and 21 classes, when classes where literally nothing but a combination of skills (and attributes). They served no function other than helping you pick skills if you couldn't be bothered to do it yourself. How that can somehow be construed as a good thing compared to Skyrim's no class system is beyond me. Plus, it says Morrowind has 13 birth signs and Skyrim none, but Skyrim have the exact same signs except they're called standing stones, but functions in the exact same way.

This picture is horribly Morrowind-biased, the creator even had to lie in order to make Skyrim appear worse.

Not to mention the categories are alle specifically created to highlight what one person liked about Morrowind. It's basically just listing differences between the games. So congratulation, whoever made this, you've shown us once and for all that Morrowind and Skyrim are not the same game.

[–]erick_discordia 74 points75 points ago

Not to mention most of the classes in Morrowind where functionally useless unless you enjoyed having your ass handed to you at higher levels. Much like the older games, often times it seemed picking a class wasn't an indicator of play style but of your desired difficulty level.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points ago

At higher levels no matter what your starting class was you pretty much became a super hero, as enemy level did not scale.

[–]Aydaanh 22 points23 points ago

Every thing in /r/gaming is horribly biased. I like no classes because it lets you mold you character into what you want, and adapts to your playstyle. Every time a new game comes out in a series everyone circlejerks to how awesome the last one is and how aweful the new one is. When the new Elder Scrolls comes out, everyone will be circlejerking on how awesome skyrim was.

[–]ObidiahWTFJerwalk 11 points12 points ago

When Morrowind was out, people were playing it and saying, "This game would be perfect if it just had this bunch of minor changes." Which Bethesda put in when they made Oblivion. People played Oblivion and said, "Morrowind was better, because it didn't have all this stuff the players asked for and included a bunch of stuff that everyone used to agree was a bad idea. But what we really want is this." So Bethesda makes Skyrim based on what people said while playing Oblivion. And everyone complains and gets super-nostalgic for the "good old days."

Moral of the story: Never try to give players what they want, and least of all anything they ask for.

[–]LordSovot 1 point2 points ago

Moral of the story: Never try to give players what they want, and least of all anything they ask for.

Oblivion was fine, it was just dumbed down. Sure, you had pretty graphics and physics, but you lost out on a ton of stuff.

Oblivion had less factions, and the factions that were present weren't really fleshed out too well with the exception of the Dark Brotherhood. Oblivion also introduced the whole quest protected NPC nonsense, which is incredibly aggrivating.

You also had monsters being heavily based on your level, which on one hand took away the Morrowind style of "Wander into cave, get destroyed by stupidly strong monsters". However, you really lost much of the sense of danger that came with exploring, as anything you would come across would generally be your level with a few exceptions. Not like you would explore much anyway, as fast travel is completely free and can be done anywhere as long as you aren't in combat.

All I know is that I appreciate that they addressed some of the concerns, but in addressing said concerns, they dropped a few things that made Morrowind a great game. The underlying cause for some people staying in the Morrowind camp is mostly because Oblivion marked when the Elder Scrolls dropped much of the heavier RPG elements in order for it to be more accessible to people who had never tried the series. I'm not saying this was a bad change, as it got the series out onto the main stage, but I was one of the people who enjoyed the absolutely ridiculous complexity of Morrowind.

[–]methyboy 113 points114 points ago

Morrowind: 22 settlements, Skyrim: 9 settlements

Ah, I see we're deliberately counting things differently for Morrowind and Skyrim to make the differences seem larger than they are.

The 22 settlements in Morrowind includes all major cities as well as small towns. Yet the 9 settlements in Skyrim only includes the 9 capital cities, while ignoring all other small towns like Riverwood and Helgen.

If you count things the same, it's 22 settlements in Morrowind and 17 settlements in Skyrim. Nevermind the idiocy of just comparing numbers like this as if they are indicative of quality in any way.

[–]Mahler5 16 points17 points ago

However, the point made about the factions was pretty valid. There was a ridiculous variety of factions in Morrowind, which made the world feel a little more alive. And even better, you actually had to be good at that faction's specialty to advance. You couldn't hack and slash your way through the mage's guild like in Skyrim or Oblivion.

[–]ZalRed 4 points5 points ago

There was an abolitionist faction. I really liked the flavor it added simply by being there.

[–]ohwhoaslomo 1 point2 points ago

The faction system in Morrowind was vastly superior to Skyrim. In Skyrim, joining different factions has no consequences. You can join them all. In Morrowind, you could only join one Great House because they are all competing and your disposition would decrease with members of the opposing houses. Which made it more difficult to interact with those characters, forcing you to consider these things and approach each situation with some strategy. Joining certain factions gave you perks like being able to murder people in broad daylight with witnesses and get away scott-free (Morag Tong) for instance. It was so much deeper than Skyrim, and most of the guild in the latter feel superficial at most; like their only purpose is to provide more quests and loot.

[–]summerteeth 2 points3 points ago

Nevermind the idiocy of just comparing numbers like this as if they are indicative of quality in any way.

If we are just going by pure numbers then Daggerfall kicks the crap out of Morrowind.

[–]Inkthinker 8 points9 points ago

I'm pretty sure there's more than 9 settlements. 9 cities, sure. But that ignores the villages and small settlements that dot the landscape, like Dragon's Bridge or Riverwood.

-EDIT-

Including villages, it's up to 16. There's also camps and inns that are more standalone though, which it ought to bring it closer.

[–]LashBack16 23 points24 points ago

Personally i would have said something about the compass telling you were to go vs the journal and text based directions. I feel that the journal is way more immersive and promotes exploration.

[–]religion_is_wat 6 points7 points ago

Morrowind, no Fast Travel. Explore.

1 Mark and Recall.

[–]cjsr4c 68 points69 points ago

Is no one interested in why that guy has so many George Castanza pictures?!?!

[–]TehSoulEater 95 points96 points ago

When you're on 4chan for a few days you'll learn to start a folder of reaction faces for every possible circumstance ever know to man, and then some.

[–]linasas123 41 points42 points ago

who doesn't

[–]whatyouknowmane 7 points8 points ago

Costanza is a meme on /sp/ and /v/, among other boards

[–]Robstaley 3 points4 points ago

isn't it obvious?

[–]speedymcdoomsday 101 points102 points ago

The only thing i hated about Morrowind was the Combat. I mean I FUCKING STABBED THE GUY IN HIS FACE AND I MISSED.?

But i kinda missed the rest in the Other games.

[–]MattyFTM 34 points35 points ago

There are mods that can fix that. There are a ton of great Morrowind mods for a whole host of things. Heavily modded Morriwind is absolutely awesome.

[–]Stooowayy 21 points22 points ago

This is like comparing real boobs to fake boobs. Either way you are going to have a great time.

[–]cycopl 41 points42 points ago

Morrowind was more of an RPG while Skyrim is more of an action-RPG. They're both better in different ways.

[–]AngelixArch 23 points24 points ago

Definitely stuff missing for Skyrim :\

I think the one that disappointed me the most was the helmet, gloves, chest+legs, boots combination... It's simply too small.

Love the game and all but there could have been many improvements...

[–]vari-slash 27 points28 points ago

Apparently the combination of the chest and legs clothing was in order to make it easier to render multiple NPCs in one area. I'll take more NPCs and a more immersive world over some extra armor slots any day.

[–]AngelixArch 3 points4 points ago

I agree completely! But it is still something to miss... :L

Nothing major, but still. We look badass anyway xD

[–]warner1 10 points11 points ago

I just really miss the way armor (armour) worked. I liked being able to mix and match and have a pauldron on just one shoulder.

[–]scumfuc 11 points12 points ago

The best part of Morrowind putting a enchanted robe and skirt over your enchanted glass armour.

[–]supersharp 4 points5 points ago

This had to be "single" george speaking. "In-a-relationship" george would never have known this.

[–]strongscience62 5 points6 points ago

Am I the only person who preferred creating crazy stupid spells and enchantments in Morrowind based on magic effects I already learned as opposed to only being able to buy spells and find enchantment properties?

[–]bvilleneuve 12 points13 points ago

I guess by the numbers Morrowind is a more mechanically complex game than Skyrim, but I reject the logic that that makes it a better game. The thing that's wrong with Skyrim isn't that the systems lack complexity, it's that everything is just that same-y quest structure with shitty dialogue.

[–]Kagenphoenix 3 points4 points ago

I disagree with sleeping being mandatory to level up.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points ago

Fun fact: Bethesda will never ever ever be able to release a TES game, and have nostalgics admit it to be better than morrowind, no matter if it dispenses blowjobs.

[–]Untz234 18 points19 points ago

All /v ever seems to do is complain about modern games

[–]MrIste 18 points19 points ago

The /v/ hivemind seems to believe that every single game made after 2004 is irredeemably shit.

[–]prannisment 16 points17 points ago

Removing classes and birthsigns in Skyrim was an improvement. It allows the player to make decisions as they go along, instead of having to decide their entire style of play all at once.

[–]_Wolfos 4 points5 points ago

The weapons missing in Morrowind wasn't a good thing. Seriously, it's frustrating as hell when you see clearly that it connects but it just makes an unsatisfying sound and misses.

[–]nanospecial 46 points47 points ago

Arbitrary choice inflation doesn't make a better game.

300 different names for direct DPS spell isn't a choice. Just redundancy.

[–]dragonsandgoblins 17 points18 points ago

I agree with that whole heartedly, which is why I was disappointed in Skyrim's magic system. The number of different spell effects are hugely limited compared with Morrowind's, and even Oblivion's. In Morrowind all the different schools of magic feel different and have crazy diverse uses; from levitating, to telekinesis to paralysis. Hell even the raw damage spells had flavour once you add in the spell creation mechanic:

Ok I want a spell that does fire damage

Excellent, do you want that on what you touch, on a target or on yourself?

I totally want to throw fire at people, so target

Good choice, what blast radius from the point of impact would you like?

7 Meters, let's fuck up groups of bitches

Would you like to do damage over time or all at once?

All at once

Ok, how much damage?

Um, 15

Would you like to add any other effects to this spell?

Yes, a 50% weakness to fire

[–]RielDealJr 11 points12 points ago

When they all do different amounts of damage, with different chances to work, and different magicka costs it a choice.

[–]bumblebeesscareme 29 points30 points ago

A good majority of those are annoying and definitely downgrades. Others... Eh... I'm either impartial or fail to see why it's bad. Example, sleeping to level up. I wanna set my skill points asap, no need to find a bed to rest on what I've learned.

Also, even though on paper Morrowind should have better combat, it really doesn't. I know Skyrim makes you stupidly over-powered, but at least the combat actually feels kinda decent.

[–]bigsol81 2 points3 points ago

Fuck all of them and give me an upgraded Daggerfall.

I want the ability to create a huge variety of spells. I want a map with thousands of towns and dungeons. Fuck it, I'll even take the horrid spaghetti dungeons that you get lost in forever!

[–]evil_toad 2 points3 points ago

that left out all of the stuff that skyrim has that morrowind doesn't

[–]IsolatedWolf 3 points4 points ago

It definitely makes Skyrim easier to pick up for someone who isn't hardcore into those types of games, like myself. It kind of irritates me to have to worry about so many different aspects.

[–]GLBB2814 2 points3 points ago

So we are going to forget that the standing stones can be changed at anytime you wish as compared to the birth signs that were permanent?

[–]LordKryos 2 points3 points ago

to be fair, this is a one sided comparison, purposely made to make Skyrim look bad. there are attributes to Skyrim much better than Morrowind, like the leveling system and ambiance, in my oppinion atleast.

[–]cptki112noobs 2 points3 points ago

Hey, if i don't end up raging rather than having fun, I'm pretty okay with Skyrim.

[–]mnkybrs 4 points5 points ago

They could have saved some time by just making

Morrowind:

Mushroom cities.

Skyrim

No mushroom cities.

The fantastical, over-the-top element of Morrowind is what's been missing in Skyrim and Oblivion. Meeting Vivec? Exploring Tel Fyr and meeting Yagrum Bagarn? The fight against Dagoth Ur is one of my favourite videogame memories.

I know you met interesting people in Skyrim, but they all just looked like regular people. The super dragon just looked like a dragon.

[–]NippleTassle 2 points3 points ago

You're forgetting the most important part of any RPG, IT HAS A BETTER STORY TOO!

[–]CannibalShinobi 28 points29 points ago

The dice rolling combat sucked and having to sleep to level up wasn't a positive thing.

[–]Vorokar 18 points19 points ago

Depends on what you want in a game. I like rpg's, and like to feel the world. If I want hack slash, loot and kill, I'll play Diablo.

[–]CannibalShinobi 39 points40 points ago

Dice rolling only really works in games that don't have direct combat. It's suppose to simulate missing and dodging in games that don't really give the player the direct ability to do so. In Elder Scrolls you can actively dodge, especially projectiles, now if it there was dice rolling in addition to being able to actively dodge then you can break any balance projectile weapons once had. In an action RPG like Elder Scrolls, where you have direct control over your character, dice rolling becomes obsolete.

[–]Vorokar 3 points4 points ago

True. My comment was directed at the latter bit, and I should have specified. I too loathe the dice rolling, but the rest of the game more than makes up for it to me.

[–]Mrmib 4 points5 points ago

This guy just says that More Stuff=Better, and doesn't assume that simplifying some fields may be an improvement. Plus he clearly leaves out things about Skyrim to make it seem worse, there are at least 16 settlements in Skyrim, not 9, for example.

[–]JohnComplains 5 points6 points ago

More doesn't mean better.

[–]nMarauder 4 points5 points ago

A lot of the aspects that people seem to find negative, in regards to aspects like needing to sleep to level up, or the classic, almost pen-and-paper style combat, give a challenge to the game that isn't present in Skyrim, nor many other, RPGs in today's world.

I miss the intricacies of combat that roll modifiers, hit checks and saves allowed for. Most of today's games, in my opinion, seem to focus around damage-based combat. Sure, status effects do play a small role, but most often its about maximizing damage to win fights.

The harder difficulty - and therefore the more profound achievement with progress - of earlier games wasn't simply because the monsters had more HP and the stuff at the shops cost more. It took dedication to master that sort of combat style. Even Morrowind was a bit dumbed down over earlier systems. And its only got worse since.

tl;dr What I'm mostly saying is that the constraints are good ways for a game designer to give you challenges and a sense of accomplishment, not just smashing buttons to kill things with loads of HP. The game is in the details. I think Castanza is making a great point about how difficulty has been stripped out of games.

[–]GexGecko 4 points5 points ago

They both crush Oblivion, so that's all that really matters.

[–]Variar 17 points18 points ago

When Morrowind was released nobody complained about this stuff.

If they made Skyrim with all the stuff Morrowind had it would be regarded by a large amount of people as a shit game.

That is why Bethesda wanted to make it simple enough for your common, casual gamer and to make it deep enough for long time TES fans. They succeed only at former.

[–]Magnum86 13 points14 points ago

That's because Morrowind was release roughly 10 years ago. Oblivion and Skyrim don't have the same excuse. They're using an incredibly old combat system that is frankly quite shit compared to other systems in today's market.

[–]DachshundBob 6 points7 points ago

This reminds me to reinstall Morrowind...

[–]JeanJeanJean 4 points5 points ago

Any love for Daggerfall?

[–]Zebrikz 16 points17 points ago

Morrowind was an epic fantasy adventure simulator. Skyrim is a kill more Draugr simulator.

[–]Raven-Mapleson 2 points3 points ago

Huh, I've never played Morrowind, but I love Skyrim. I guess I'll have to haul my ass over to my boyfriend's house and play his Xbox.

[–]Weevle 2 points3 points ago

Morrowind is awesome notwithstanding the fact it's been technically surpassed by both Oblivion and Skyrim, of which the former had a high immersion value mostly due to Jeremy Soule's haunting soundtrack. On the other hand what made Skyrim so special is the novelty of mixing Morrowind's and Oblivion's properties in one experience (there's also some Fallout 3 thrown in).

[–]ninja_plz 0 points1 point ago

In skyrim,would the ebony blade be counted as a katana?

[–]cbfw86 0 points1 point ago

so much NOSTALGIA [squirt]

[–]Karhaedron 1 point2 points ago

In skyrim and oblivion I disliked the lack of armor components and flight, but the trend in gaming industry is to simplify things so I (sadly) expected and found a shorter story and less difficulties. Besides that, they're good games and still quite immersive.

[–]PrimeIntellect 1 point2 points ago

Skryim did basically everything related to combat better, but Morrowinds story and quest lines were just so much more engaging, and ultimately more rewarding for anyone who relly liked to dig in and read, and explore the world. Not to mention the locale itself, Morrowind, was much much weirder and more interesting than Skyrim.

[–]fenwaygnome 0 points1 point ago

Morrowind was way too easy because things scaled all weird. I also felt lost too often because it was a bit too open world. Still one of the best games, ever though.

Oblivion sucked balls.

[–]qmanoulton 1 point2 points ago

I would just like to point out that skyrim also has attacks based on movement, not just of length of click

[–]Enrys 1 point2 points ago

Comparison of Oblivion to Skyrim?

[–]asdfghjkl92 1 point2 points ago

most of these also apply to daggerfall, so daggerfall > morrowind?

[–]Frexican 1 point2 points ago

based on this logic Daggerfall is the greatest TES game of all time

[–]Die-Nacht 2 points3 points ago

Dwarf fortress will put both games to shame when it is done.

[–]schmalpal 1 point2 points ago

Agree with almost everything, particularly the very last point re: leveling. I've been hating on Oblivion since I first reached high levels in it, days after its release, for the same reasons. The minute random bandits started having full suits of Daedric, and I realized I hadn't found a single unique artifact solely via exploration, I was severely disappointed. Granted, I still put 250-300 hours into Oblivion - but Morrowind was 4-5x that.

I do love the "infinite" view distance and graphical improvements, obviously.

The always-hit / always-cast changes that Oblivion/Skyrim implemented are nice as well. The whole roll-determines-successful-hit thing in Morrowind pretty much pigeonholed you into choosing The Lover as the birth sign, and forced you to choose Agility when leveling - plus it wasn't very fun having to rest before each fight or constantly spam Restore Fatigue potions at the start (although Morrowind's superior enchanting system allowed you to do Constant Effect restore fatigue on, say, a Daedric Tower Shield).

I've only put 70 hours into Skyrim so far, since it was pretty obvious after that amount of time that it was exactly like Oblivion. I might put another 100 in eventually, but coming from someone whose favorite game of all time is Morrowind and who takes weeks off work in advance for any Elder Scrolls release, it's telling that I've only dedicated 70 hours over the course of 8 months.

[–]brushbender 2 points3 points ago

Sigh...how I miss the good old days of Morrowind. Oh wait. Modded-to-Oblivion-and-back PC version. Still my favorite Elder Scrolls game, for these precise reasons (well, the combat did need fixing. Thanks modders.)

[–]entopic 2 points3 points ago

Main quest items can be dropped in skyrim (essence extractor). Now-a-days its called a glitch

[–]bogie895 1 point2 points ago

all of this....and I still love Skyrim

[–]Nage 1 point2 points ago

lik gta4 and san andreas

[–]fleeflicker 1 point2 points ago

Morrowind > no nude mod

Skyrim > nude mod

:€

[–]gjallerhorn 2 points3 points ago

false.

[–]ChewiestBroom 1 point2 points ago

I agree with most of this, but the dice roll hit/miss combat in Morrowind was a pain in the ass. It's kind of annoying to smash someone in the head with a warhammer from two feet away and end up doing no damage at all.

[–]IWasPhone91 1 point2 points ago

Since when was missing swings for no reason considered a good thing?

[–]themonkeygrinder 1 point2 points ago

I don't get the "no option for no armor" part. You can just wear clothes, or don't select armor. Or did he mean something else.

[–]gjallerhorn 2 points3 points ago

there was an unarmored skill I believe

[–]budman200 1 point2 points ago

I think for essential npc's theres way too many quest npcs to have all of them unkillable. There should be an option to turn off essential npcs all together. That way you really have to deal with the consequences of killing random people. I hated that I couldnt go kill The jarl of a region. There should be an option to play with it on for people who dont want to miss anything, but an option to turn it off if you want to play that way.

[–]arkain123 1 point2 points ago

According to this D&D is and will always be the greatest game of all time

[–]gare_it 1 point2 points ago

this is why I can still go back and replay morrowind and have a great time, i got burned out on skyrim at about 85 hours

[–]MythicDawn 1 point2 points ago

Oblivion> Morrowind>Skyrim

[–]MythicDawn 1 point2 points ago

I am a hardcore oblivion fan, before a bias is called i'd like to point out that i've played them in order from daggerfell to Skyrim and have devoted AT LEAST 200 hours for each. Now morrowind is a great game and for me ranks second overall, Oblivion however takes the cake. many people like skyrim because it gives many a feeling of being a badass, wearing Armour with mostly black or red color palettes and forging giant cleavers to decapitate their enemies with. The opposite is true with the morrowind fans, not that they don't feel like complete badasses, its that they get their high from flying around at blinding speed or being part of a government sanctioned execution guild, I for one find a good mix of these elements in oblivion, whether it was from slaying demonic daedra ( As in the humanoid ones ) or watching bandits slowly die from poisons i created, it gave me a feel of power without being TOO powerful in a sense .... plus where else would you find a cat that collects calipers or an or that eats horses?

[–]WhatDoIEvenPutHere 1 point2 points ago

skyrim has better grapfics

qed forever

[–]bleunt 1 point2 points ago

So are rap songs the best because they have a lot of words, or is a song better depending on how many instruments are played in it?

[–]Dyson201 1 point2 points ago

I would have to say that I was a little disappointed in Skyrim. I enjoyed the game and some things were nice, but it seems like they took a world (TES) and though about how they can make it appeal to more people. The easiest way to do this is to simplify it and make it forgiving.

Skyrim was fun and I really liked it, but I felt less in control than I did with Morrowind or Oblivion. It just felt like the game wanted me to get stronger and I can level everything up and get stronger and win. But my freedom of choice in leveling up is simpler and you level up a lot more. Game is still fun but it just seems simpler and this doesn't appeal to more hardcore RPG players (It's the same argument for Dragon age 1 vs 2)

[–]RexCogitans 2 points3 points ago

And yet Skyrim is still a better game (in my opinion).

To me this is a great example of how quality > quantity

Daggerfall had the biggest game world, but it didn't actually make it a better game for it.