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1539
1540

ABS braking Explained. (i.imgur.com)

submitted ago by craftymethod

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[–]i_like_underscores_ 252 points253 points ago

Looks like the one with ABS is closer to the water.

[–]slartbarg 207 points208 points ago

ABS increases braking distance on a loose surface (like sand, gravel, snow) for the tradeoff of making sure your wheels don't lock up and that there is not as much loss of control. So in this case, the no-ABS dog managed to properly threshold brake, whereas the ABS dog mashed the brakes.

[–]IMongoose 80 points81 points ago

ABS is actually better at stopping due to friction. When the wheel is turning, it grips the ground better and you stop faster. If the wheel locks and just starts to slide, it will actually take longer to stop. Think of it this way, if you are trying to move a large dresser or something, it's hard to make it move at first but then it gets easier. Someone who knows more about physics can back me up, but there is the general concept.

[–]lousy_at_handles 107 points108 points ago

What you're talking about is the coefficient of static friction vs. the coefficient of kinetic friction.

Generally (all cases?) the coefficient of static friction is higher than kinetic, and thus the force of friction is greater.

[–]pexoroo 90 points91 points ago

Facts about ABS, since there is a lot of nuance:

-For the general population, ABS decreases stopping distance.

-Professional drivers can stop faster without ABS because they can take the wheels closer to the coefficient of static friction than an ABS. **Update - as a few dudes have pointed out, this may no longer be true of modern ABSs.

-ABS does not allow you to turn and control the car while you are braking. That it allows you to do so is a misconception that results in the statistic that ABS cars aren't much safer than non-ABS cars, because people still thrash the wheel around and lose control. ABS is for stopping in a straight line and allows slight maneuvers. That said, I'll take an ABS any day.

-On gravel, sand, and snow, ABS increases your stopping distance. This is because without ABS, the tire will lock up and actually dig into the loose surface, either connecting with the hard surface underneath (in the case of snow or gravel), or simply dig in deeper (like in the beach in OP's example). The locked tire sliding along the hard under surface (or dug into the sand) will stop you faster than an ABS'd tire trying to maintain traction on the loose top surface.

[–][deleted] 51 points52 points ago

There are a lot of errors in this.

  • Professional drivers STILL use ABS when the rules allow for it. They dont a lot of times because it takes away from driver skill. It WILL stop faster since the valve block can pump and release the brakes 10s of times faster than any human (if not more), and the computer can process wheel speeds thousands of times faster than your brain.

  • ABS will increase your control when braking. When the wheel locks up, you might as well be sliding on four rubber blocks. The tire rolling is what allows you to change direction.

  • Off-road depends on exactly what type of terrain you're talking about. Sand, gravel, and snow will likely be better off without since locking the wheels forms a wedge in front of the tires. BUT if you're on asphalt with tiny loose gravel on top, you're just going to slide over it.

EDIT: All of you who are downvoting me are welcome to elaborate on why.

[–]PumpValve 3 points4 points ago

upvoting because this discussion is interesting, your comment included.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point ago

Science is fucking cool!

[–]pexoroo 1 point2 points ago

I don't see errors.

-Professional drivers can stop faster, as I stated. Still, I bet most use ABS, as you said. Our statements don't conflict. It takes a lot of focus and skill to use non-ABS for hundreds of laps, and most prefer ABS. Additionally, in the studies that I read on the subject, it's not about the amount of calculations or whatever that the computer does. It's that the manufacturers of consumer-level ABS choose to set the engagement point some distance ahead of the coefficient of friction. Professional drivers can work with the play and bring the tires closer to the point of sliding.

-You do not have as much control as you may think when ABS is activated. I've tested this many, many times in simulators and on the track.

-Of course there is a point where the amount of stuff on the hard surface will become negligible and the ABS starts to win out. It depends on how you define "loose surface" - I didn't define it as asphalt with a tiny bit of loose gravel on top.

[–]Tuna-Fish2 2 points3 points ago

You do not have as much control as you may think when ABS is activated. I've tested this many, many times in simulators and on the track.

Doing that test was a part of my driving instruction, and while I have only actually done it twice, I absolutely had almost full steering control while applying full brakes with ABS. I have no idea how you could have done it many, many times in the real world and come to a different conclusion. Perhaps you used some older abs system? (Modern ones don't really even pump brakes anymore, they just smoothly apply the maximum braking they believe they can without making the wheels stop).

[–]JMorris779 -5 points-4 points ago

I actually prefer driving cars without ABS. I find being able to induce a slide by braking can be very useful. I don't want the computer to make decisions for me.

EDIT: Why the downvotes? I like drifting.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points ago

Why would they use ABS if they could brake faster without it? I dont know what year you think it is, but modern ABS systems are going to calculate wheel speed and apply the brakes with more frequency than any human.

How much control do you think I think there is? Obviously if you go barreling into a hairpin turn @ 120mph in a Honda Accord, ABS isn't going to save you.

The last one was not so much an error as an expansion. Just saying it's effectiveness is going to vary depending on EXACTLY what terrain you're on.

[–]Rombard 1 point2 points ago

It's about repeatability. If you're just going 120-0 in a straight line then you may be better threshold braking without ABS . 120-0 on a racetrack with variable surfaces (rain) and cars pushing you off line your brain needs to focus on other things.

One of the other major factors is differences in how a road tire and a racing slick loose traction. In a road tire it's designed to have grip slowly fade away so you have a chance to save the car. In a racing slick you get more grip at the limit but when you exceed the traction limits the tire turns to ice.

[–]NobodySpecific 0 points1 point ago

Because they need to reserve those resources for cornering, shifting, accelerating, which involves a lot of observation and remembering of mental markers they have for all of those actions. It's one less thing to worry about, and it's not very often that a professional driver has to come to a complete stop. (note that I'm not saying that a professional driver CAN stop faster without ABS, simply answering the question of why would they want ABS if they can stop faster)

Also, when going full manual, they risk locking up the tires (due to something on the track for example) and losing control, while ABS helps to mitigate this risk somewhat.

[–]SI_Bot 0 points1 point ago

SI conversions:(FAQ)

  • 120mph = 193.1 km/h

Why would they use ABS if they could brake faster without it? I dont know what year you think it is, but modern ABS systems are going to calculate wheel speed and apply the brakes with more frequency than any human.

How much control do you think I think there is? Obviously if you go barreling into a hairpin turn @ 120mph(193.1 km/h) in a Honda Accord, ABS isn't going to save you.

The last one was not so much an error as an expansion. Just saying it's effectiveness is going to vary depending on EXACTLY what terrain you're on.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

Every. Single. Time.

[–]BootDisc 0 points1 point ago

I think bosch makes a racing system you can cal, but most systems wont be calibrated right after new calipers and rotors. They will still work, but the initial correction will a bit off till the closed loop compensates.

Edit: I'm implying most pros don't run stock. Late Edit: Pros better not flat spot (accidently lock). Tires tend to find find flat spots and when they do, tires lock at that spot more easily.

[–]adorith 0 points1 point ago

The short version I've always heard is something like this: The tire only has a certain amount of friction, meaning a certain amount of grip. You use that grip to make an acceleration, either against the direction of movement, i. e. braking, or at an angle to the direction of movement, i. e. steering. The more of the friction that you use up on one thing, the less is left for the other. ABS tries to achieve a balance where you stop as fast as you can while retaining as much friction as needed for reasonable course adjustments.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point ago

This is true to an extent. Traction will be split up between accelerating,braking, and cornering, which is one reason front wheel drive cars tend to understeer. However, ABS increases traction overall. What that traction is used for is irrelevant.

[–]pomegranati 8 points9 points ago

what about packed snow and ice?

[–]pexoroo 22 points23 points ago

Well you're fucked, obviously.

Kidding. The above only applies to loose surfaces. On hard surfaces, the base case holds true where ABS takes you close to the coefficient of static friction and it's helpful. It wasn't clear in my explanation, but the differentiating factor is a loose surface vs. a hard surface, not necessarily the type of surface (sand vs gravel vs snow). The locked tire has to be able to dig in for the above to apply.

[–]ztherion 1 point2 points ago

Doesn't help if your tires are sprinning freely in the snow, so you need snow tires for it to be effective.

[–]Rombard 1 point2 points ago

Threshold brake and steer with your foot! RWD/rear biased AWD will let you make corners you could never make with FWD.

[–]leica_boss 1 point2 points ago

I actually prefer no abs on snow and ice (packed or unpacked snow). It's not that I can pulse my foot faster than abs, I can't. It's because locking the wheels isn't the worst thing in the world, especially if you have snow tires. With the wheels locked, you'll often dig into the snow, and you will still stop, as the dog did in the linked picture. Often times ABS releases the wheels too soon, letting them lock for a bit gives them more time dragging on the surface of the road, during which time your car will slow down, and eventually stop. Not to say that you should just clamp on the brakes, but for ABS to assume that it can stop the car without the wheels locking (for example on snow) will lead to a very long stopping distance.

[–]Russz 2 points3 points ago

The point of ABS isn't only to stop you. The point is to maintain control over your vehicle in case you want to swerve away. If you are not using ABS and you press your breaks and your tires lock up, you can't turn. Not being able to turn is far worse than breaking closer vs further.

[–]herruhlen 0 points1 point ago

You shouldn't break or swerve heavily at all if possible. Let go of the gas and try to steer away.

If you start to skid, you're fucked. But I guess ABS is superior.

[–]The_Free_Man 8 points9 points ago

Some of that is false. Wikipedia

-Professional drivers cannot stop faster without ABS. Computer controlled systems always have superior potential over human beings. ABS is able to measure things that a driver cannot, more accurately than a driver could and react based off of those measurements much faster than a driver can. Older ABS is likely an exception in some cases, but modern ABS is not.

-ABS does allow you to turn and control the car while you are braking. While ABS obviously can't overcome understeer, it is able to prevent skidding which would have been caused by the wheels locking.

[–]pexoroo 0 points1 point ago

I updated my OP with your info from Wikipedia.

[–]pexoroo -1 points0 points ago

Your first point is interesting, and conflicts with what I know. I'll check it out.

To address your second point - it depends on how you define "control". ABS allows you to brake safely in a straight line without locking up the wheels, which indeed allows you to maintain control. But the second you start steering, you'll realize the car isn't doing what you want - you don't really have control, you're just stopping in a straight-ish line. So it depends on what you mean by "control" - I was referring to the latter case, where you can't really steer the car where you want to go because you're braking.

[–]Kaell311 4 points5 points ago

I believe you are incorrect about steering and braking with ABS.

[–]pexoroo 0 points1 point ago

Maybe, but I don't think so. Here's a study done in 1996 by the IIHS:

http://www.iihs.org/news/1996/iihs_news_121096.pdf

And another: http://www.iihs.org/research/advisories/iihs_advisory_17.html

Main page here: http://www.iihs.org/research/topics/antilock.html

The most recent study from 2000 notes that ABSs are no longer associated with an increase in fatal car crashes, but there's been nothing positive since. Apparently they're a huge help for motorcycles, though.

[–]Kaell311 3 points4 points ago

Those are statistics showing no benefit of ABS on reducing the number of crashes statistically. It says nothing about whether or not ABS provides the capability to steer in a controlled manner while braking (stab-and-steer).

While surprising, they do not contradict what I believe to be the case with ABS and steering.

"The primary advantage of ABS is to help drivers maintain steering control in an emer- gency or hard braking situation." - http://www.libertymutualimages.com/ProfDavePublic/documents/ABS%20LP5039.pdf

[–]Kaell311 2 points3 points ago

Those are statistics showing no benefit of ABS on reducing the number of crashes statistically. It says nothing about whether or not ABS provides the capability to steer in a controlled manner while braking (stab-and-steer).

While surprising, they do not contradict what I believe to be the case with ABS and steering.

[–]pexoroo -1 points0 points ago

This is true. The studies only speculate on the cause. I've read that in a few places, though, so it stuck. Also, you still have very little control with ABS engaged. When they say "additional control", they mean "the car isn't totally spinning out", not "you are free to jam the wheel around".

[–]CakesArePies 1 point2 points ago

Motorcycles lock the rear wheel white often. I'd be more interested in anti-over-the-handlebars though.

[–]BootDisc 2 points3 points ago

Abs will add control if the system is configured to. It comes down to stopping dist vs control. With just wheel speeds, you can only have one or the other. The more inputs you have, the better you can do, as you move toward ESC and TC. But the cheap systems will always do the min to meet govt standards, which aren't all that high. Most govts are starting to require ESC now.

[–]Kriegenstein 0 points1 point ago

If you stay the confines of the traction circle you can have both.

ABS helps that happen without the driver having to think about it. By preventing lockup there is a bit of traction available for turning.

In general though, its best to turn, then brake..or brake, then turn.

[–]pillowmeto 1 point2 points ago

The mechanics of rubber and asphault interaction result in the highest friction and a low slip speed, no totaly static. A ideal racing driver would be at that point of maximum friction.

[–]masters_in_fail 0 points1 point ago

Formula 1 banned ABS a few years ago. It is considered a driver's aid.

[–]thattreesguy 4 points5 points ago

i know that ABS systems stop in shorter distance than normal braking, but wasnt sure of the how since your statement of static friction is correct.

I decided to google it

Unfortunately, i ended up learning WAY TOO MUCH ABOUT ABS

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/brakes/brake-types/anti-lock-brake1.htm

[–]nonameworks 7 points8 points ago

I am not certain of this in the case of skidding tires. When they skid they are torn apart they do not simply slide.

[–]energy_engineer 9 points10 points ago

When they skid they are torn apart they do not simply slide.

This is true of all materials - if you have one material sliding against another, they will wear. Dynamic friction coefficient takes this into consideration and is why it is dependent on both materials.

[–]nonameworks 0 points1 point ago

I am pretty sure you are incorrect because friction is the conversion of other forms of energy into heat. Wear is the result of breaking molecular bonds (since the rubber in tires is vulcanized it is a single molecule), which requires energy that may or may not come from heat.

[–]energy_engineer 1 point2 points ago

Coefficient of friction is an empirical measurement - that is, you have to actually test it and it cares not of the mechanism by which the force is achieved. Slide two things across each other and they will wear. Dynamic friction takes this into consideration - there's no way to remove wear from the equation as there is no equation, it's an empirical measurement.

[–]supa_fly 5 points6 points ago

exactly. rolling uses static friction because the contact patch of the tire is not in motion relative to the road. Skidding on the other hand, the contact patch is sliding against the road, thus the lower (relative to the static) friction increases the stopping distance.

[–]mus7ard 7 points8 points ago

although i was also told that locking your brakes on a softer surface like dirt or sand will actually stop you very fast, because the tire will dig into the surface and cause clumping of the material in front of the tire, stopping the vehicle faster ofc ABS works a lot better on regular driving surfaces.

[–]GraffyHooves 2 points3 points ago

Don't know why someone tried to downvote you since it's true. Abs will try to keep traction on the loose sand/dirt/gravel on top while locked up it will put more material in the way or even dig in to touch the surface underneath.

[–]pomegranati 3 points4 points ago

I think you read that right. On loose surfaces, the tire will dig into the loose surface into the hard surface underneath, and also to create sort of like a wheel chock for your wheels.

On hard surfaces, however, like wet pavement, packed snow, or ice, ABS will give you a better stopping distance.

[–]supa_fly 3 points4 points ago

hmm i didn't know that but it makes sense!

[–]Riddlerforce 12 points13 points ago

Hey guys, I thought I was browsing r/funny.

[–]Shway1000000 6 points7 points ago

I have no idea whats going on right now

[–]karanj 0 points1 point ago

Welcome to Reddit.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points ago

Fo' ril. Ala dis lernin' maykin muh brane hert...

[–]Calvin_v_Hobbes 1 point2 points ago

BOOM.

Science'd.

[–]honeyfage 0 points1 point ago

Generally (all cases?)

Yes, all cases. Think about what it would mean to push something across a surface where the coefficient of static friction were lower than kinetic with just enough force to overcome the static friction but not enough to overcome kinetic friction. As soon as it starts moving, the higher kinetic friction would kick in and it would instantly stop moving.

[–]GoFidoGo 0 points1 point ago

I fucking LOVE physics

[–]RyanoRhino 1 point2 points ago

False. A skilled driver who can use non-abs to their maximum point of efficiency is better than someone just standing on their ABS brakes.

But to be fair, a driver so skilled is rare, so for the general public, ABS is better.

[–]Turtlewithashotgun 1 point2 points ago

Also, when the tires on a car are skidding, the wheels are in fact oscillating, at a high frequency, along the road meaning the tires are not in contact with the road 100%. ABS keeps your car from skidding so that your tires are always in contact with the road.

[–]slartbarg 7 points8 points ago

The point is that non-abs will stop sooner if you know how to reach the threshold of braking without causing the wheels to lock up.

[–]ButtTheHoopoe 14 points15 points ago

In which case, ABS shouldn't be activating.

[–]pexoroo 9 points10 points ago

Not exactly. ABS activates a bit before the tires begin to slip. Professional drivers can actually stop faster without ABS because ABS kicks in a bit before it's necessary. But for people like you and me, ABS is the way to go.

[–]ButtTheHoopoe 6 points7 points ago

It also prevents you from purposely locking the brakes, if you're trying to do tricky stuff in the snow, like a scandinavian flick.

[–]aywwts4 4 points5 points ago

Ah, TIL what my FWD winter driving style is called

[–]ButtTheHoopoe 2 points3 points ago

Haha, where I grew up, they built a ton of roads for a subdivision long (~10 years) before they actually got around to building houses. No curbs either. All this was on former farmland too, so nice and flat. Of course, none of this was ever plowed in the winter, as there were no houses, so there was no point.

It was brilliant. My friends and I could practice doing whatever in our cars, with zero risk to our cars. I eventually was able to flip my 94 Corolla around, slide into reverse, and keep going (sans ABS).

Made me really sad when they finally built houses there.

[–]lost_cosmonaut 0 points1 point ago

I don't usually need to lock the wheels to slide. Left foot breaking or even throttle lift can get the tail out around a fast corner. ABS doesn't seem too intrusive to me.

[–]ButtTheHoopoe 0 points1 point ago

My current car is a stick, so to pull that off I have to heel and toe it with the right and left is for clutch. I haven't spent too much time practicing it (I have neither the free time nor access to suitable roads that I used to), so i usually accidentally mash the brake too hard at some point, the ABS engages, and I ruin the whole thing.

[–]twatsmaketwitts 0 points1 point ago

Can't beat lift off over steer for unexpected excitement!

[–]lost_cosmonaut 0 points1 point ago

the Achilles Heel of the 911!

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points ago

This is gonna be a case-by-case kind of thing. A more advanced modern ABS system can calculate wheel speed and brake pressure/frequency faster than your brain ever could.

[–]pexoroo 1 point2 points ago

Yeah, I haven't seen any recent studies on the subject. My understanding, though, is that it's not about the number of calculations or math involved, it's that the point at which manufacturers choose to kick on the ABS is before the coefficient of static friction is reached. Professional drivers can beat the built-in play.

[–][deleted] -3 points-2 points ago

Im a BMW technician and it's my job to know these sorts of things. Why would a manufacturer choose to kick on ABS before coefficient of friction? They get as close as possible which is far closer than any human could achieve (in a modern system).

[–]pexoroo 1 point2 points ago

I assumed it was for safety and to account for variance in the driving surface. Also, consumer level ABS systems are probably different than those they'd put in race cars, right? I honestly don't know, but I'd assume so. IANAMechanic.

[–]BootDisc 0 points1 point ago

The system has to work on ice and hot tarmac for ABS and ESC, which is a wide range or requirements to meet for the hydraulics alone.

[–]ctr1a1td3l -1 points0 points ago

Tolerance.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point ago

No. Your brain could never match the calculations of tire speed and brake pressure/frequency of an ABS system.

[–]FlyingPasta 1 point2 points ago

I'm not sure what you're trying to say in the first part, but the dresser example is due to static vs kinetic friction. The coefficient of friction (how friction-y something is) for static objects is bigger than coefficient of friction for moving objects.

[–]IMongoose 12 points13 points ago

Right, when the wheel is moving, it is actually static friction. Small parts of the tire are gripping the ground at a time. If the tire locks, it turns into kinetic friction, one part is sliding. Pretty sure I'm right about this, but I seemed to have rustled some jimmies.

[–]FlyingPasta 4 points5 points ago

Okay, I think I get what you're saying now. It doesn't sit comfortably in my mind, but I think I understand it theoretically.

[–]asherrd 3 points4 points ago

This might help you think about it. In the real world, with friction, when a wheel rolls down a hill, it rolls down a hill. As in it spins. Friction is what causes it to spin as the bit of wheel on the bottom sticks to the ground.

If you could make a wheel and a hill out of something with zero friction and you set the wheel on the hill, the wheel would go down the hill, but it would not roll, it would only slide.

Maybe this isn't related. I'm drunk.

[–]FlyingPasta 1 point2 points ago

Okay got it! Took me a while.

[–]supa_fly 1 point2 points ago

oh woah i responded the same thing to a guy above you because I didn't see your response. Upvote!

[–]MigratedCoconut 0 points1 point ago

I'm sorry, but you are wrong. Rolling friction is its own separate entity that is lower than kinetic or static friction. When an object is rolling, now appreciable amount of energy is lost to friction because of the spin. But that doesn't make it static friction.

The reason that it works better than just holding the brake pedal down is that for a split second after you hit the brake, the tire is totally stopped (here is where static friction comes in). Then as that is overcome by your velocity you start to slide and your coeff of friction reduces.

[–]Kaell311 1 point2 points ago

No. He was right. That is something else if you read it.

ABS is to keep a static CoD instead of kinetic.

[–]MigratedCoconut 0 points1 point ago

I misunderstood his comment. I thought he meant that as the tire is spinning (i.e. you are driving down the street) you would use static friction.

[–]acr2001 1 point2 points ago

Actually, you are both correct. On a flat surface (wet or dry) ABS does help you stop sooner because it helps keep the contact patch with the road at the highest coefficient of friction.

On snow sand or other loose surfaces, this does not apply. Why? Because with ABS the wheels do not lock up, thus the aggregate (snow, sand, etc) does not build up in front of the wheels. When the aggregate DOES build up in front of the wheels (like a plow) this helps the vehicle to stop sooner. For this reason, you can stop sooner WITHOUT ABS on loose surfaces.

[–]kDubya 0 points1 point ago

On asphalt, yes. On a loose surface, locking your brakes will stop you faster because the material will dam up in front of the tires.

[–]chadsexytime 0 points1 point ago

Unless you're trying to properly stop on an icy road by gently pressing and depressing the break over and over again. ABS will give a big 'fuck you' to that attempt and shit all over everything, possibly sending you into a spin.

[–]Breathing_Balls 3 points4 points ago

And put up a bit of a struggle earlier in the pull. The paw prints indicate a rapid neck shake and some fancy footwork.

[–]Calvinball05 0 points1 point ago

People are trying to explain this with rational explanations regarding the benefits of ABS on solid vs loose surfaces, which is all well and good for a car, but in this case the 'ABS dog' is slightly closer to the water because his leash is slightly shorter. It's not that complicated, folks.

[–]I_POTATO_PEOPLE -1 points0 points ago

Looks like he's carrying a bit more weight though.

[–]nickhelt 76 points77 points ago

They decided pretty early that they wanted nothing to do with water

[–][deleted] ago

[deleted]

[–]hahanobutreally 31 points32 points ago

I don't know what he said, but I'll downvote it anyway.

[–]nstarz 17 points18 points ago

How did you downvote a deleted message?

[–]hahanobutreally 70 points71 points ago

Skillfully

[–]thegraymaninthmiddle 9 points10 points ago

Nobody likes you. Go away.

[–]TheFlyLife 12 points13 points ago

What did he say? It's deleted now.

[–]thegraymaninthmiddle 14 points15 points ago

Okay, you probably won't believe this, but he posted a bunch of pictures of some random Asian guy just hanging out with his girlfriend. Then some Shitty Ascii art of a woman(I think) in a bikini and some very detailed Ascii art of a man jacking-off.

load more comments (2 replies)

    load more comments (5 replies)

      [–]bluemeep 7 points8 points ago

      That's actually a really good way to give your dog a lifelong fear of water.

      [–]pexoroo 25 points26 points ago

      Reposting this at the top to maybe address the inevitable ABS discussion before it starts.

      -For the general population, ABS decreases stopping distance.

      -Professional drivers can stop faster without ABS because they can take the wheels closer to the coefficient of static friction than an ABS.

      -ABS does not allow you to turn and control the car while you are braking. That it allows you to do so is a misconception that results in the statistic that ABS cars aren't much safer than non-ABS cars, because people still thrash the wheel around and lose control. ABS is for stopping in a straight line and allows slight maneuvers. That said, I'll take an ABS any day.

      -On gravel, sand, and snow, ABS increases your stopping distance. This is because without ABS, the tire will lock up and actually dig into the loose surface, either connecting with the hard surface underneath (in the case of snow or gravel), or simply dig in deeper (like in the beach in OP's example). The locked tire sliding along the hard under surface (or dug into the sand) will stop you faster than an ABS'd tire trying to maintain traction on the loose top surface.

      [–]Kriegenstein 0 points1 point ago

      The effect is often referred to as plowing. Also helpful in the northern areas of the country when one encounters wet leaves in the fall.

      [–]craftymethod[S] 32 points33 points ago

      Couldn't help but post this one again. Saw there was only a couple old posts but gave me a good giggle. :)

      [–]TheIndigoSky 26 points27 points ago

      You know, I wouldn't mind reposts nearly so much if everyone was so forthright and honest about it (and bothered to check for recent submissions).

      [–]craftymethod[S] 19 points20 points ago

      Karma decay ftw :)

      Its a handy tool for finding how frequent image postings are:

      http://karmadecay.com/

      [–]benjaminmktn121 9 points10 points ago

      I like you.

      [–]Endsthreadswithllama 3 points4 points ago

      And I like you...

      [–]benjaminmktn121 1 point2 points ago

      Mmmm llama kisses

      [–]Endsthreadswithllama 6 points7 points ago

      Sexy, ain't I?

      [–]benjaminmktn121 5 points6 points ago

      /r/llamaboners

      [–]Endsthreadswithllama 5 points6 points ago

      Don't you dare make that a thing

      [–]syflox 1 point2 points ago

      This looks shopped. I can tell by the pixels.

      [–]benjaminmktn121 0 points1 point ago

      It's too damn late.

      [–]xroni 0 points1 point ago

      Never seen it before and really enjoyed it, thanks!

      [–]Ry_Gor 6 points7 points ago

      If if were properly explained, the cat that slid would closer to the water than the other cat, not closer.

      [–]craftymethod[S] 8 points9 points ago

      I vote this man needs another shot!

      [–]The_SNL_Encyclopedia 7 points8 points ago

      I believe those are dogs

      [–]royisabau5 3 points4 points ago

      Not on loose sand

      [–]jimtracysmyhomeboy 3 points4 points ago

      I thought they were corgis.

      [–]Stza 2 points3 points ago

      There is nothing I hate more than watching someone drag or yank on a dogs neck with a cord.

      [–]Drunk_McSAP 1 point2 points ago

      This is vastly more helpful than anything I learned in driver's ed. I didn't understand what ABS was until it started snowing.

      [–]agnostic_opossum 1 point2 points ago

      Goddamn this is so old. I'm sorry to be "that dick" but it is...

      [–]TheShiz123 1 point2 points ago

      Debates over how ABS functions > people questioning possible mistreatment of dogs

      [–]ratajewie 3 points4 points ago

      Isn't the braking after "ABS" redundant? Like saying ATM machine? ABS stands for antilock braking system, so it's already known it's used for braking.

      [–]FinnianWhitefir 6 points7 points ago

      I'm going to say no because it's demonstrating the 'braking' of the ABS system. It'd be like if I posted a diagram of how an ATM 'tellers'.

      I suppose it gets complicated because brakes can be ABS or non-ABS, so theoretically I could say 'Come look at my ABS brakes' and theoretically be correct.

      But frankly, jewish rats shouldn't be driving anyways.

      [–]MissPezerific 3 points4 points ago

      ABS system

      I see what you did there.

      [–]EightBit69 3 points4 points ago

      What heartless monster would drag them that far (on their neck) to something they are obviously scared as hell of?

      [–]yer_momma 2 points3 points ago

      Someone who wants then to learn to swim and possibly survive if they fall in a pool. Or they may learn to enjoy swimming. I had to force my dog in the pool the first time, now he loves water.

      [–]clifford25 1 point2 points ago

      You could always pick them up and place them in the water. No need to drag them by their necks.

      [–]M0b1u5 1 point2 points ago

      Not many people know that cars are not generally capable of locking their wheels when travelling at speed.

      Only the very top supercars in the world are capable of locking a wheel(s) at 100mph or above. The average family saloon can't even lock its brakes until it hits about 30 mph or so.

      The only reason you ever increase the size and power of the brakes on your car is to allow it to get closer to locking the wheels at high speed.

      For instance, my Porsche 928 has outstanding, fade-free, non-ABS brakes even after 30 minutes on a track - but they are not good enough to lock the wheels at speeds over about 75 mph. So, when I am at speeds well above this, and the corner speed is 75 mph or faster, then when I get on the brakes, I push them absolutely as hard as I possibly can, because there is no chance that they could lock up, and every extra pound of force I can put into the pedal results in significantly more pressure on the pads. (I run DOT4, so it never boils)

      At speeds over 125mph, how hard I push the pedal REALLY has a big effect on how quickly I decelerate - and I guess I am putting around 80-90 kilos of pressure on the pedal. It's a great feeling, because you can't fuck it up - unless you try to turn in too fast when trail-braking. :P

      It's only when the car gets down to 75 mph that I have to feather the pressure off to stop the fronts going up in smoke (Brake bias is 59/41 front to rear) and I have to concentrate really hard to get the last little bit of performance out of the braking area.

      [–]HandWarmer 1 point2 points ago

      The friction of your tires on the road does not change with speed. Neither does the force your brakes impart on the rotors. Therefore if you can lock tires at 50km/h you can lock them going faster.

      Personally I've locked my tires going 70km/h in a 30-year-old, 700 kg Nissan shitbox.

      [–]Lord-Longbottom 2 points3 points ago

      (For us English aristocrats, I leave you this 30 mph -> 80640.0 Furlongs/Fortnight, 75 mph -> 201600.0 Furlongs/Fortnight, 75 mph -> 201600.0 Furlongs/Fortnight, 75 mph -> 201600.0 Furlongs/Fortnight) - Pip pip cheerio chaps!

      [–]SI_Bot 1 point2 points ago

      SI conversions:(FAQ)

      • 100mph = 160.9 km/h
      • 30 mph = 48.3 km/h
      • 75 mph = 121 km/h
      • 125mph = 201.2 km/h

      Not many people know that cars are not generally capable of locking their wheels when travelling at speed.

      Only the very top supercars in the world are capable of locking a wheel(s) at 100mph(160.9 km/h) or above. The average family saloon can't even lock its brakes until it hits about 30 mph(48.3 km/h) or so.

      The only reason you ever increase the size and power of the brakes on your car is to allow it to get closer to locking the wheels at high speed.

      For instance, my Porsche 928 has outstanding, fade-free, non-ABS brakes even after 30 minutes on a track - but they are not good enough to lock the wheels at speeds over about 75 mph(121 km/h) . So, when I am at speeds well above this, and the corner speed is 75 mph(121 km/h) or faster, then when I get on the brakes, I push them absolutely as hard as I possibly can, because there is no chance that they could lock up, and every extra pound of force I can put into the pedal results in significantly more pressure on the pads. (I run DOT4, so it never boils)

      At speeds over 125mph(201.2 km/h) , how hard I push the pedal REALLY has a big effect on how quickly I decelerate - and I guess I am putting around 80-90 kilos of pressure on the pedal. It's a great feeling, because you can't fuck it up - unless you try to turn in too fast when trail-braking. :P

      It's only when the car gets down to 75 mph(121 km/h) that I have to feather the pressure off to stop the fronts going up in smoke (Brake bias is 59/41 front to rear) and I have to concentrate really hard to get the last little bit of performance out of the braking area.

      [–]SuperTimo 0 points1 point ago

      Stupid bot km/h is not an SI unit. The base SI unit for speed is m/s.

      [–]Ry_Gor 1 point2 points ago

      I've never seen this bot before. Good point though, someone somewhere screwed up

      [–]BootDisc 0 points1 point ago

      Yeah, I tracked my car last week and ABS didn't kick in very much. Had lots of chatter, but didn't effect stopping. After a full day of 25 on 50 off finally got some fade and some smoke on the fronts... the rear pads were gone too, hehe.

      [–]maydaydemise 0 points1 point ago

      Ice will lock up brakes in no time. Driving over black ice is probably the scariest thing I've ever done in a car without ABS.

      [–]klove614 1 point2 points ago

      Guess I should of posted this in r/funny...

      [–]shabbadu 7 points8 points ago

      After reading the first few comments I thought I'd stumbled into r/physics.

      [–]ImAllowedToSayFuck 8 points9 points ago

      should of

      [–]royisabau5 2 points3 points ago

      of

      [–]CajunPenguin 0 points1 point ago

      That makes it look like ABS is bad now idiots will say "oh yeah my new ride is awesome I got the no ABS model" lol

      [–]Markymark36 0 points1 point ago

      Let the debate begin

      [–]BeardedSinceBirth 0 points1 point ago

      GENIUS ! !

      [–]DaNizzles 0 points1 point ago

      Assisted braking system braking explained

      [–]shitfourbrains 0 points1 point ago

      That's definitely two in the bush

      [–]2FMS 0 points1 point ago

      r-r-r-r-repost

      [–]Epolo2012 0 points1 point ago

      hahahahahahahahahahaha

      [–]tehbatz 0 points1 point ago

      looks familiar

      [–]theymustneverknow 0 points1 point ago

      Haha lol

      [–]end_guy 0 points1 point ago

      Nailed it.

      [–]randygiesinger 0 points1 point ago

      Honestly, I wish there was an ABS off button, i probably wouldn't have rear-ended that lexus who decided for whatever reason to come to a sudden screeching, smoky halt in the merge lane at 100km/h, at the exact second i was checking my blindspot

      [–]keiyakins 1 point2 points ago

      Wrong, you would have hit at a higher speed, unless you were driving on extremely soft ground.

      [–]eliterofler 0 points1 point ago

      while not exactly an ABS off "button" you could always just pull the fuse that controls the ABS system if you're really that adamant about driving without anti-lock brakes, depending on your vehicle you might also lose traction control (controls wheel spin during acceleration) and stability management (keeps the car from spinning around on you) since I believe all those systems are reliant on information from the ABS system... If I turn off traction control in my mom's jeep (simple button press on the steering column) then it also disables the anti-lock brakes as well...

      [–]rufos_adventure 0 points1 point ago

      is no one gonna say 'repost'?

      [–]kabanaga 0 points1 point ago

      As an Automotive Engineer...I approve!

      [–]boobsbr 0 points1 point ago

      needsmorejpg.jpg

      [–]th_squirrel 0 points1 point ago

      Did anyone else think of Acrylonitrile butadiene styrene first, or am I the only plastics nerd?

      [–]chromedip 0 points1 point ago

      Olde

      [–]andersonlive 0 points1 point ago

      repost explained: seen this before

      [–]Kronicler 0 points1 point ago

      I just think of that test track video.

      [–]nidi617 0 points1 point ago

      I saw this on the front page within the last week.

      [–]lsetten 0 points1 point ago

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-lock_braking_system

      [–]ogeezeoman 0 points1 point ago

      I used to drive my father-in-law's Acura TL. I think it was the ABS, but I remember the light on the dash starting with a V (VSD maybe?). I would stop at a light and try to accelerate, the light would go on, and I was stuck at 5 MPH. It was also hard to turn the steering wheel. Happened multiple times. I live in Arizona, so it definitely wouldn't have been ice.

      [–]phumble45 0 points1 point ago

      I knew when I saw this image macro of two dogs in the sand, posted in r/funny, that there would inevitably be pages and pages of discussion about how abs brakes work.

      Reddit did not disappoint.

      [–]Soogoodok248 0 points1 point ago

      Apparently ABS has less stopping power...

      [–]GMonsoon 0 points1 point ago

      They thought you said "draggies", not "walkies"

      [–]dobidoo 0 points1 point ago

      Perhaps poster should try without the cords. Dog's aren't sure if he wants to drown them. I know I'm a bitch. But try to get the situation.

      [–]HardyBrother 0 points1 point ago

      they are both fucked anyways....

      [–]IRLpuddles -2 points-1 points ago

      i laughed harder and way longer at that than i should have.

      [–]derelictmo -1 points0 points ago

      I thought ABS stood for absolute braking for a long time. I have since read a book and grew a beard.

      [–]snehituralu -1 points0 points ago

      I LOL'd in public at this one. A) it's funny. B) it's exactly right. Upvote to you, sir.

      [–]maineiscold -2 points-1 points ago

      very nice, very nice.

      [–]danielberube -1 points0 points ago

      10th Billion repost. New to reddit?

      [–]M0b1u5 -1 points0 points ago

      100% pure, concentrated awesome. Just add reddit, and stir!

      [–]Zhabba_Zheeba -2 points-1 points ago

      I had a hearty chuckle at this one.

      load more comments (10 replies)

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