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all 130 comments

[–]civex 44 points45 points ago

sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

[–]huntley101888 7 points8 points ago

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Thanks for the link. If you notice, it appears that the video jumps ahead just as the photographer was snapping the picture that OP linked to.

[–]u8eR 3 points4 points ago

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The picture is taken right around the 4:17 mark in this video (when the priest reaches into his pocket). You can even see the flash.

[–]huntley101888 0 points1 point ago

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Good point. I didn't watch the entire video, so I didn't see that part. I was referring to 0:30 where the photographer was walking into position. I'm pretty sure that coincides with the different video camera angle from 4:17.

[–]mlikweblue 0 points1 point ago

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After he's dead?

[–]u8eR 0 points1 point ago

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No. Watch the video. They replay the video but at a different angle starting around 4:02. By 4:17, he's still alive, and that's when this picture is taken.

[–]mlikweblue 0 points1 point ago

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myyyyyyyyyyy bad.

[–]Dubbys 3 points4 points ago

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1:02 shows two men taking pictures.

[–]2hris 1 point2 points ago

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While he has the hood on

[–]Dubbys 0 points1 point ago

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correct

[–]northerncacy 3 points4 points ago

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Does anyone know if it is true that in firing squad a few people will have blank bullets, but they never know who has the blank bullets? If so, did they do that back then?

[–]Hoyarugby 6 points7 points ago

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I believe they did, so that if you had issues with the whole thing you could convince yourself that you didn't kill the prisoner

[–]civex 3 points4 points ago

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Here's some information on that topic.

I've read and seen interviews with army guys on these details, and they're told that someone has a blank. Each person interviewed said he could tell from the kick that he had a live round.

[–]martext 0 points1 point ago

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Anyone who's at all familiar with the weapon they're using can tell the difference between firing a blank and a real round. I suppose you could always fool yourself into thinking that it felt different if you're having a really hard time with it though.

[–]WhitTheDish 4 points5 points ago

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I don't have a lot of gun training and not enough to tell the difference between a live round and a blank but if you watch the footage and pay attention to the post behind the general, you can see a lot of sawdust (?) and (apparent) bullet holes appear after the squad has fired which leads me to believe some or all of them had live rounds. Combine that with a very short amount of time to aim, makes me believe that they all had live rounds.

[–]mightye 2 points3 points ago

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I believe there is only one blank round (not only one live round). To give any who struggle with their conscience on this matter an opportunity for plausible deniability to themselves.

[–]daffmeister 0 points1 point ago

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[–]joshuamnr 0 points1 point ago

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This may not be directly answering your question but I can assure you there is a distinct difference between firing a live round and a blank round. If this was true and the members of the firing squad have experienced live fire, they would know it was a blank round after they pulled the trigger.

source: Military: I have trained with blank and live rounds.

[–]captainjon 6 points7 points ago

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IIRC, after that guy from Utah that was executed by firing squad, I believe they have one that uses a wax-like cartridge opposed to a blank and the recoil is supposed to be identical as a live round so nobody knows whether or not their's was the lethal round.

[–][deleted] ago

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[deleted]

[–]the_raptor 1 point2 points ago

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I wonder why they don't just setup a bunch of rifles that can be triggered remotely. This way you'd only need one person to activate the system or "pull the trigger", and you're quite a few steps detached from the actual killing.

At that point you may as well just have one guy with a rifle. The point of the firing squad is to make the group responsible for the killing not an individual (also the reason for the "blank round"). People have an easier time doing terrible things as part of a group.

[–]ryy0 1 point2 points ago

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How about we do it in the style of Winterfell? Those who pass the judgment carry out the execution. The judge pushes the button.

[–]the_raptor 2 points3 points ago

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I'm Australian, we prefer not executing anyone.

[–]ryy0 0 points1 point ago

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Well, I do think that's better.

[–]WileyE 0 points1 point ago

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Why don't we just find a sociopath and give him a rifle?

[–]the_raptor 0 points1 point ago

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Because most sociopaths don't fair well in disciplined groups. Disregard for societal rules and expectations being what makes one a sociopath.

Also for most of the history of firing squads they were expected to be used en masse in the event of a mutiny or similar. A situation where the military establishment would be hard pressed to find suitable numbers of sociopaths.

[–]WileyE 0 points1 point ago

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Well, firing squads just seem outdated. Surely there must be a new, humane, exciting way of killing the condemned?

[–]joshuamnr 0 points1 point ago

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That makes sense. I've never fired that sort of cartridge before. I would be curious to see how it actually feels. But thanks for the info!

[–]Sasselhoff 0 points1 point ago

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Recoil is determined (so to speak) from the weight of the round going off. That is why a .44 magnum kicks much harder than a 9mm (well, and difference in powder). A wax bullet will not recoil the same, or even remotely the same, as a lead/copper bullet.

[–]birdbrainlabs 1 point2 points ago

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Recoil is determined by the momentum imparted to the round, not the weight of the round.

In theory, if you give a wax slug a much higher velocity than a lead round, you should be able to get the same recoil.

[–]Skwerley 2 points3 points ago

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ok...this is probably pointless to post, but I swear to christ like 3 months ago I had a dream about this, and I've never even heard this guys name before. I remember the priest walking over and everything...in the dream he made a comment that someone had hit the target in the head...

[–]BulbousAlsoTapered 15 points16 points ago

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Why'd they hang some Nazis and shoot others?

[–]merpes 18 points19 points ago

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I believe that those convicted in the nuremburg trials were hung. Dostler's trial and execution happened before that and was handled solely by the americans.

[–]omarsdroog 32 points33 points ago

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Hanged. If they were hung is another matter.

[–]henrysherman 2 points3 points ago

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They said you were hung They was right!

[–]jonah4342 -2 points-1 points ago

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I think that hung is now an acceptable past-tense term for hanging executions. Could be wrong though

[–]robertbobbobby 6 points7 points ago

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You are, although people make the mistake a lot.

[–]schneidro 2 points3 points ago

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Shakespeare made up words regularly. Language is ever evolving, English especially, since there's no official English language academy unlike most other languages. Therefore, most disputes such as this have no official "right" answer.

[–]protoopus 6 points7 points ago

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i don't remember where i found this:

The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary. -James D. Nicoll

[–]taint_odour 2 points3 points ago

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Ima bet jonah4342 is not the sixth incarnation of the bard.

[–]ThePhenix 1 point2 points ago

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If you do not accept language change, language will change you

[–]Subterania 2 points3 points ago

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I think some requested a shooting squad, as due military execution, whereas hanging was a more commonplace form of execution of common criminals.

[–]MrGZ 34 points35 points ago

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The mix of courage, fear and acceptance in his face just made me stop, think and get in to comment.

[–]Johnzsmith 5 points6 points ago

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Agreed. He looks quite intense here.

[–]mingy 26 points27 points ago

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Interesting - I am in favor of executing war criminals, however, the film said his 'crime' was ordering the execution of 15 US operatives sent behind enemy lines, posing as Italians. Presumably, this means they were not wearing their uniforms, and, as spies, I am pretty sure that makes them fair game. There must be more to the story

[–]nemoomen 37 points38 points ago

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They were American spies and America was the jury.

[–]blazemore 8 points9 points ago

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Judge, jury and executioner

[–]konkeydong 5 points6 points ago

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and candlestick maker.

[–]acegibson 1 point2 points ago

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The argument of the Prosecution was that since the deceased had been soldiers of the United States Army, dressed as such and engaged on a genuine military mission, they were entitled to be treated as prisoners of war.

link

[–]batmanmilktruck 0 points1 point ago

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this is war. this happens. its not pretty, this was the worst war. executing generals isn't exactly a new concept to war.

[–]judgemebymyusername 0 points1 point ago

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It does not make them fair game.

[–]loki010[S] 3 points4 points ago

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[–][deleted] 7 points8 points ago

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Wow. Incredibly stoic

[–]whateverdipshit 3 points4 points ago

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[–]ThePhenix 0 points1 point ago

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Thank you.

[–]DouglasEves 3 points4 points ago

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[spoiler] Tom Cruise dies

[–]taint_odour 1 point2 points ago

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Before or after he comes out of the closet?

[–]Mrdomo 0 points1 point ago*

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Damn yoouuuuu! I still haven't seen the end of that movie!

[–]Sketchetera 4 points5 points ago

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There were several legal weaknesses in the case against Dostler. First, it was not clear that executing captured enemy soldiers disguised by not being in uniform violated any convention pertaining to prisoners of war. Second, it could not be established that Dostler had in fact issued the order of execution.

http://www.nd.edu/~com_sens/issues/old/v17/v17_n5.html#dostler

[–]PedroDelCaso 2 points3 points ago

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Stunning. Cheers for sharing

[–]Fineas_Greyhaven 4 points5 points ago

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I realized that my lame Joke about Nien, Nien bullets was insensitive.

[–]genthree 2 points3 points ago

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Nein?

[–]Fineas_Greyhaven 0 points1 point ago

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Nein is German for no. it Sounds a lot like Nine.

[–]genthree 0 points1 point ago

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lol, yes, but the way you spelled it in your first post would actually be pronounced "neen" in German.

[–]krislol22 1 point2 points ago

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The Chaplin looks like the priest from the movie The Poltergeist.

[–]andrewsmith1986 4 points5 points ago

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I did not know that you got to stay in your uniform.

[–]thesalesmandenvermax 6 points7 points ago

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You usually do after being stripped of rank insignia and decorations. This general kept the former but has had his ribbons removed.

[–]ItsOnlyNatural 12 points13 points ago

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To be quite frank I find that to be amazingly insulting considering he is not one of our soldiers and we have no right to rescind the honors or rank bestowed upon him by his country.

[–]doomtown 2 points3 points ago

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Interestingly, they left the Ostfront medal ribbon http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:DEU_Ostmedaille_BAR.svg

[–]oneadvent 1 point2 points ago

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Amazing, thank you!

[–]Minerva89 1 point2 points ago

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On the one hand, his persistence in executing 15 American soldiers is horrible. On the other hand, "a life for a life", so to speak, is still a foreign concept to me.

The complexities of human morality...

[–]heuheuheuheuh 0 points1 point ago

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Since when is war moral? These men were in the business of killing, and it was an all or nothing kind of war.

[–]Minerva89 0 points1 point ago

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I suppose, but if there was a choice not to kill, I would inherently choose that option. More specifically, the death penalty has always been something I'm very uneasy about. War is war, and the killing of another during combat is, to a degree, justifiable. Killing those who can't defend themselves however, that just doesn't sit right with me.

As for the morality of war, well, people have justified their wars as righteous and moral in the past and present. It's almost as if the onus is upon those who oppose war to prove its lack of morality.

[–]bk553 2 points3 points ago

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"The execution of German General Anton Dostler by Tummy Rubbing, 1945"

FTFY

[–]jahallah 1 point2 points ago

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[–]Therealaerv 0 points1 point ago

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I'm not a lawyer, but it does seem to me that several parts of this look quite a lot like a railroad.

It would, therefore, be necessary for the authorities instituting the proceedings to notify the representative of the protecting Power (Art. 60), the representative of the protecting Power would have the right to attend the hearing of the case (Art. 62, para. 3), the alleged war criminal would have the right of appeal against any sentence against him in the same manner as persons belonging to the armed forces of the detaining Power (Art. 64), sentences pronounced against prisoners of war would have to be communicated immediately to the protecting Power (Art. 65) and, if sentence of death were passed on a prisoner of war, a communication setting forth in detail the nature and the circumstances of the offence would have to be addressed to the representative of the protecting Power for transmission to the Power in whose armed forces the prisoner served (Art. 66, para.1) ; and it would, finally, be forbidden to carry out the sentence before the expiration of a period of at least three months from the date of the receipt of this communication by the protecting Power (Art. 66, para. 2).

The Military Commission in the Dostler trial decided that the provisions of Art. 63 of the Geneva Convention were not applicable to the case. As is customary, the reasons of the Military Commission were not given.

That part, from the conclusions at the end, says that the Military Commission was under obligation to contact the German government, notify them of the sentence, and allow them a chance to appeal.

It was a crazy time for America, and all the propaganda that was used at the time to inspire "fighting spirit" in our people practically required people to be used as scapegoats. And, right or wrong, we took out that aggression on the German military officers.

[–]Punchomatic 1 point2 points ago

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Yeah, guy executed Americans, got executed by Americans.

You don't want to be on the losing side of a war.

[–]MizerokRominus 0 points1 point ago

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Only the winners write history, after all.

[–]Therealaerv 0 points1 point ago

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And that pretty much sums it up right there. After a war, a government has to prove that they were right to get involved. And, to the US that means dead military officers and government officials.

[–]StGreve 0 points1 point ago

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No matter his crimes there simply is no honor in this.

[–]jtt123 0 points1 point ago

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This is why I resubscribed to pics

[–]oysterpirate 0 points1 point ago

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And then he was reincarnated as Matt Damon.

[–]slevvio 0 points1 point ago

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Why is the guy on the right holding a blackberry?

[–]Captain_Tea -2 points-1 points ago

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You dun goof'd, Anton.

[–]the_goat_boy -1 points0 points ago

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I thought they tried all the generals, and hanged the ones who were guilty?

[–]ThePhenix -1 points0 points ago

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I'm not sure where I stand on this issue. Spies were executed by both sides during the war, and indeed had been for centuries. I suppose he was doing right by his country in the first place, but obviously the victor is the one who writes history.