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Obama says any law passed must have universal principles and not be based in religion (cdn.front.moveon.org)
submitted 8 months ago by jerr0328
[–]Kujo_A2 40 points41 points42 points 8 months ago
can't read the source in the image, can you post it in text form please?
[–]dustlesswalnut 69 points70 points71 points 8 months ago
"Democracy demands that the religiously motivated translate their concerns into universal rather than religion-specific values... it requires that their proposals be subject to argument and amenable to reason. Now, I may be opposed to abortion for religious reasons, to take one example, but if I seek to pass a law banning the practice I cannot simply point to the teachings of my church or evoke God's will. I have to explain why abortion violates some principle that is accessible to people of all faiths, including those with no faith at all." -Barack Obama
Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOwzy-vKaFI
[–]lowflyingmonkey 5 points6 points7 points 8 months ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOwzy-vKaFI
Here is a shitty quality version of the speech. I don't think it is the one in the source but it still the same speech.
[–]Galphanore 10 points11 points12 points 8 months ago
Democracy demands that the religiously motivated translate their concerns into universal rather than religion-specific values... it requires that their proposals be subject to argument and amenable to reason. Now, I may be opposed to abortion for religious reasons, to take one example, but if I seek to pass a law banning the practice I cannot simply point to the teachings of my church or evoke God's will. I have to explain why abortion violates some principle that is accessible to people of all faiths, including those with no faith at all. Barack Obama
Democracy demands that the religiously motivated translate their concerns into universal rather than religion-specific values... it requires that their proposals be subject to argument and amenable to reason.
Now, I may be opposed to abortion for religious reasons, to take one example, but if I seek to pass a law banning the practice I cannot simply point to the teachings of my church or evoke God's will. I have to explain why abortion violates some principle that is accessible to people of all faiths, including those with no faith at all.
[–]starkeffect 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
This is from his "Call to Renewal" speech in 2006. It was actually this very speech that convinced me to take him seriously as a candidate.
*Edit Entire speech: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3tdoQr3BQ1g&feature=results_main&playnext=1&list=PLD477414D57B89790
[–]slackerdc 501 points502 points503 points 8 months ago
As disappointed as I am with him he's still the best choice by a couple of light years.
[–]inikul 282 points283 points284 points 8 months ago
It's sad that this is what voting has become in this country: lesser of two evils.
[–]n0t_5hure 109 points110 points111 points 8 months ago
solution.
[–]mandrilltiger 19 points20 points21 points 8 months ago
actual solution
[–]deskwarrior 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Well...yes! Why don't we have this? What's the real downside?
[–]mandrilltiger 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago*
Well as smart as the founders of the U.S. it isn't exactly intuitive that the First Past the Post would be so awful.
And now the two main parties will probably never let this happen because of how powerful they are. And the only people who can really pass a law like this are the party leaders.
[–]frissonFry 12 points13 points14 points 8 months ago
You could say it's a Final Solution, even.
[–]Cantora 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Colbert has my vote. And ALWAYS WILL...until I force him to marry me and then he commits suicide because our gay marriage isn't funny. God bless you Stephen...GOD BLESS YOU.
[–]RevProtocol 5 points6 points7 points 8 months ago
I wear my 2012 Cthulhu/Dagon shirt quite frequently. Why settle for the lesser evil?!
[–]retromafia 11 points12 points13 points 8 months ago
When has it not been such?
[–]zotquix 17 points18 points19 points 8 months ago
I'm not sure what people really expect anymore with a president.
Here. I've got a time machine. Name your top 5 presidents ever. We'll give them a spin with this economy, this opposition, and this level of scrutiny due to the telecommunications revolution (read internet). Let's see how they do.
What's that? George Washington is a pile of shit? Lincoln is dicatorial turd sandwich? FDR is a commie pinko? Why oh why must we always have to choose the lesser of two evils.
Maybe the problem isn't the president. Maybe the problem is the people. Somehow we've become more sophisticated than ever before yet it seems like 'We the people' are dumber than ever before (not saying anyone here...just overall).
[–]inikul 6 points7 points8 points 8 months ago
A big problem is the lack of moderates or other parties. For example, one of the most moderate GOP hopefuls, Huntsman, dropped out because of lack of support. People run on highly liberal or conservative bases anymore. The 2 words aren't even used the way they are supposed to be. Both sides just want to pass laws and make more regulations. How is that in any way conservative?
On top of all of this, because of the lack or moderates (who are usually seen as "bad"), no one agrees on shit in congress and little gets passed. People demand the bills be changed to add provisions that will satisfy the other party. There really isn't much working together to find a middle ground. The country is too fucking split on party lines.
[–]zotquix 6 points7 points8 points 8 months ago
A big problem is the lack of moderates or other parties.
Absolutely agree here. I would fully support the US moving to a more representational, less 'winner take all' system.
, Huntsman, dropped out because of lack of support.
I liked Huntsman well enough. I would have no problem with him being president except for the fact that he would bring the Republican Party with him. Appointments and staff end up giving you the same people who were around for Bush (both of them), Reagan, and Nixon. If nothing else, I want Democrats in the White House to give us a shot at changing the makeup of the SCOTUS so the Citizens United can be overturned.
Both sides just want to pass laws and make more regulations.
Disagree somewhat, I this is an oversimplification. Sometimes people really do run for office because they want to make the world a better place.
On top of all of this, because of the lack or moderates
True, though there is more to be said here. Homogeneity can be said to be a Republican core value. Do what you are supposed to, don't stick out, and eventually you get ahead. This in itself may be neither a good nor bad thing (or at least it depends on your point of view), but it explains why the Republicans are so much better at party discipline. They follow the Reagan rule - never speak bad about another Republican. And they all vote together.
By contrast, Democrats have individualism as a core value. Whatever the merits of individualism may be, it makes it hard to get things done, even if you have a majority.
So in conclusion, a small group of Republicans can be more powerful than a large group of Democrats because the Republicans vote as a block. This isn't a terrible thing until you get situations like last Augusts budget crisis. This was a crisis that never needed to happen, but the Republican party stood together and ultimately cost the country billions because of the downgrade in debt rating.
People demand the bills be changed to add provisions that will satisfy the other party.
Well, politics is to some extent about compromise.
The country is too fucking split on party lines.
Agreed. The country is very polarized. People have this tendency towards brand loyalty that isn't exactly healthy. Again, I think the best solution would be to change the process so that more parties could thrive.
[–]inikul 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
If nothing else, I want Democrats in the White House to give us a shot at changing the makeup of the SCOTUS so the Citizens United can be overturned.
Definitely. Colbert is illustrating quite well the ridiculousness of this ruling.
My point was that the word conservative isn't used correctly anymore. It has become diluted. Passing more federal laws isn't very conservative, now is it? (remember, this is the actual meaning, not what conservative has come to mean)
So in conclusion, a small group of Republicans can be more powerful than a large group of Democrats because the Republicans vote as a block.
Herein lies the problem I was talking about. The democrats might value individualism, but to stand a chance against the republicans, they have to unite. And here we are again with being split along party lines.
[–]hominidx 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I'm sort of at a loss at who's running on a "highly liberal" platform...is Kucinich running? Or do you mean 1/3 of Ron Paul?
[–]jf_ftw 225 points226 points227 points 8 months ago
Between Turd Sandwhich and Giant Douche?
[–][deleted] 355 points356 points357 points 8 months ago
It's more like between a Turd Sandwich and a Dry Tuna Sandwich. You would prefer a Fresh Tuna Sandwich, but a Dry Tuna Sandwich is still better than anything you could make at home yourself, and you would be crazy to choose the Turd Sandwich over the Dry Tuna Sandwich. And the only reason the Tuna Sandwich is dry is because it is has been overpowered by the heat of the hot Turd Sandwich. But can you do? Nothing, if you tried making the Tuna Sandwich yourself, you would be completely engulfed by the Turds. We are lucky that we even have Tuna that is this resistant to the Turds. None of us could do better in that environment.
Obama has one of the dirtiest jobs in the world and we act like he doesn't even matter. As if anyone here on Reddit could do half as well. What's our best guess of what to do? Support Ron Paul, the Foul Smelling Spoiled Egg Sandwich that he is. Yes, we should expect Tuna to deal with the Turds, but there are just so many Turds. Capital Hill is full of Turds, and what are we doing to change that? We are ignoring the still good Tuna and cheering for another Turd.
[–]l_l_troll_j 12 points13 points14 points 8 months ago
Relevant David Sedaris essay
FTA: Then you’ll see this man or woman— someone, I always think, who looks very happy to be on TV. “Well, Charlie,” they say, “I’ve gone back and forth on the issues and whatnot, but I just can’t seem to make up my mind!” Some insist that there’s very little difference between candidate A and candidate B. Others claim that they’re with A on defense and health care but are leaning toward B when it comes to the economy.
I look at these people and can’t quite believe that they exist. Are they professional actors? I wonder. Or are they simply laymen who want a lot of attention?
To put them in perspective, I think of being on an airplane. The flight attendant comes down the aisle with her food cart and, eventually, parks it beside my seat. “Can I interest you in the chicken?” she asks. “Or would you prefer the platter of shit with bits of broken glass in it?”
To be undecided in this election is to pause for a moment and then ask how the chicken is cooked.
[–][deleted] 24 points25 points26 points 8 months ago
Excellent comment, my friend. You're exactly right about
the only reason the Tuna Sandwich is dry is because it is has been overpowered by the heat of the hot Turd Sandwich .
And the fact that we are ignoring Obama simply because he has had to compromise with crazy Republicans.
I'm saving your comment by the way.
[–]derptyherp 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
Same. Been trying to push this point for a long time.
[–]dreamCrush 68 points69 points70 points 8 months ago*
I may not like all the parts of the Foul Smelling Spoiled Egg Sandwich but come on guys it has a little toothpick with an olive on it. At least he would end the war on pickles. None of the other candidates are pro olive. Also at least i'm supporting a different sandwich even if it is horribly spoiled and none of the other sandwiches will work with it.
/sarcasm
Edit: I need to stop adding stuff to this but every time I read lower in this thread I can't help myself
[–][deleted] 22 points23 points24 points 8 months ago
And what, we turn into a nation that puts all our faith into a new leader election after election, just like Portugal does in South America? The country crumbles under the weight of the Turds, so we keep shoving a different person into the Turds every election hoping that something will change? Obama has been working towards exactly the change we want, except for extending scary spy powers. If we should be angry at anyone, it should be at the Turds that keep messing up our Tunas efforts. Maybe every time a bill was held to ransom or locked in battle, it was up to us to put pressure on the Turds, instead of blaming our Tuna.
[–]lgodsey 50 points51 points52 points 8 months ago
Yeah, I always thought it was funny how we berate President Obama for getting raped by Republicans.
"Well, if you weren't dressed so slutty, Mr President, you wouldn't get attacked! It's your fault for walking outside at night with Republicans around!"
[–]goal2004 9 points10 points11 points 8 months ago
Portugal is in Europe. I'm not sure there was a joke there for me to miss, so I'll assume you just didn't know.
[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 8 months ago
it's a joke from Arrested Development
[–]goal2004 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
I don't remember that joke :(
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
It's from the season 1 episode In God We Trust. Hopefully you're in the colonies!
[–]elbenji 3 points4 points5 points 8 months ago
Portugal for a long time was under Napoleon's control, so they all moved to Brazil and that was Portugal for a long time.
[–]lestiforget 8 points9 points10 points 8 months ago
Just like WHAT does in South America ?? I agree with the rest.
[–]mesquirrel 6 points7 points8 points 8 months ago
I think I just learned something from Turd Sandwiches.
[–]dalgeek 6 points7 points8 points 8 months ago
Best. Analogy. Ever.
[–]gargamak 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
OCCUPY SUBWAY!
[–]Transrate_to_Engrish 5 points6 points7 points 8 months ago
That is between that like the droppings sandwich and the tuna sandwich which is dried mainly. The new tuna sandwich is liked, as for the tuna sandwich where, but it is possible, with anything to make with your yourself home, rather than being insanity in order to choose the droppings sandwich on the tuna sandwich which is dried is good still and dries. Because it was overwhelmed it is with the heat of the hot droppings sandwich where and there is the only reason which the tuna sandwich is dry. But it is possible to do? Making the actual proof being completed tuna sandwich, when it is involved in completely by your yourself droppings, what. We being this tuna which is resistivity vis-a-vis the droppings are fortunate in us. We every one could not improve with the environment.
As in Obama most there is one of the works which become dirty in the world, he is not important, we act. With who of Reddit here and half way it is possible to do. What where is the presumption where we of the thing which it should do are best? The egg sandwich which makes useless stench of the thing support Ron Paul which has him does. It is, we should expect that the tuna handles the droppings, but exactly there are such many droppings. The capitol hill the droppings is complete, have we what done in order to change that? We ignoring the tuna which is possible to be quiet, vigor have attached because of another droppings.
[–]CheekyMunky 11 points12 points13 points 8 months ago
oh jesus fuckme christ i read way too much of that before checking the username
[–]Valisk 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Well hello new favorite novelty account!
[–]DelusionalZ 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I read this, then wrote up a rebuttal, in essay form, then saw the username, and realised I should be doing my homework.
[–]zotquix 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I never voted for you for Jarl, but I like the cut of your gib. Plus I like that you made me Thane and gave me Lydia even if she is sort of mouthy.
[–]antisyzygy 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I make a pretty good tuna sandwich, and my wife out-does that.
[–]helclaw9123 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
more like getting in a car with a person that farted vs. getting in a car with a person that shat in his pants
[–]Omega_Borealis 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
i swear, when i read turd sandwich in this comment, i read tuna sandwich.
[–][deleted] 8 months ago
[deleted]
[–]turdinasandwich 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
you called?
[–]orlyokthen 5 points6 points7 points 8 months ago
Obama 2012! and I for one don't see him as a lesser of two evils. Its more like a choice between candy bacon and a turd sandwich. While too much of the former might kill you, I'm not going to pick the latter.
[–]mnk224 5 points6 points7 points 8 months ago
I agree with you.. Obama never said it would be easy to change the way Washington works.. "The road ahead will be long. Our climb will be steep. We may not get there in one year or even one term, but America – I have never been more hopeful than I am tonight that we will get there. I promise you – we as a people will get there."
-Pres. Obama's victory speech
[–]mecrosis 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Dude, it is what it has always been.
[–]oddmanout 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
It's been the lesser of two evils for a long time, now.
[–]shoejunk 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I'm not sure whether this is because of a flaw in the system or because there is so much diversity of opinion in this country that any candidate would be considered "evil" (in the sense that we use the term in the phrase "lesser of two evils") by many if not most people.
Actually, it's a fucking miracle that somebody who can say this shit gets elected at all. The vast majority of Americans support a religious viewpoint, care nothing at all for atheists, and base their entire moral view on christian teachings. That the guy can even say shit like this and still get elected, much less even do anything about it, is a testament to him. If he was a pure populist he would never even whisper shit like this, because there are fuck all votes in it.
[–]aidrocsid 32 points33 points34 points 8 months ago
I think by the end of his second term your opinion of him will change. He's a long-game player. It's how he won the primaries and it's clearly the strategy he's using now. He's gotten a lot accomplished despite massive amounts of Republican interference. Last I heard Obama has already fulfilled about a third of his campaign promises and has most of the rest of them underway. He caught bin Laden, pulled out of Iraq on time, ingeniously waited for conservatives in his administration to get rid of DADT, managed to put a floor on a recession that was far worse than anyone was expecting it to be when he got into office, managed significant bipartisan health-care reform, saved the auto industry (which has already paid back the bailouts), and proposed a jobs bill that pays for itself. Obama never planned to be a 1-term president, so he's been prepared to compromise on some issues in order to retain electability while setting up for his second term. Once he doesn't have to worry about getting back into office, he can solidify what he's done and move on to some of the more extreme things progressives would like to see done. If we manage to regain a supermajority in November, we could see major reform.
[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 8 months ago
The problem is people don't know about any of that stuff. They see the country as left by the Bush administration and how shitty it was, and are blaming him for it being shitty. It like giving someone a pile of shit and them rolling it into a perfect ball and coating it with lacquer so it doesn't smell as bad, then being mad at them because it's still a piece of shit.
[–]martyvt12 22 points23 points24 points 8 months ago
In other news, the first amendment has existed since 1789 and applies regardless of what Obama says. And the White House recently restated their support for keeping the U.S. motto "In God We Trust".
[–]nermid 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Fun fact: This is only the first part of the Lemon Test.
[–][deleted] 175 points176 points177 points 8 months ago
I'm ambivalent towards him; but in all honesty, he hasn't been so bad. He's definitely better than the other choices we have. By far.
[–]StezzerLolz 130 points131 points132 points 8 months ago
Yeah. What people fail to take into account is that the reason Obama has been unnable to accomplish anything is because the Republicans have been playing party politics to such an extreme that it's become a case of "Obama said it therefore no." Hell, they even argued against what was effectively their own healthcare bill. And now all those people who were busy perverting the democratic process are running for office.
When in discussing candidates you have to choose between the terms 'Batshit insane' and 'Pants-on-head retarded' you know things are going badly.
[–]The_Holy_Bison 77 points78 points79 points 8 months ago
I like how the Republicans stopped everything Obama tried to pass, but they let the NDAA go through, and then attack him for signing it.
[–]fswmacguy 52 points53 points54 points 8 months ago
"If I can't have my way, NOBODY CAN!"
U.S. politics are like children at recess. Except these children make an unfathomable amount of money.
[–]gargamak 21 points22 points23 points 8 months ago
and their battle-ready action figures are real people.
[–]Quazifuji 13 points14 points15 points 8 months ago
And their actions affect the most powerful country in the world, and sometimes the rest of the world as a result
[–]crackyJsquirrel 32 points33 points34 points 8 months ago
Republican Agenda
Obama: yes Us: no
Obama: no Us: yes
[–]buzzkill_aldrin 17 points18 points19 points 8 months ago
"What people fail to take into account is that the reason Obama has been unnable to accomplish anything is because the Republicans have been playing party politics"
Actually, I would say that the reason Obama hasn't been unable to accomplish anything is because the Democrats didn't know how to play party politics. 257-178 in the House and 57-2-41 in the Senate. A goddamn waste.
[–]vjmurphy 17 points18 points19 points 8 months ago
To be fair, they were trying to usher in a new era of political cooperation. Unfortunately, no one told the Republicans that.
[–]salad-dressing 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Exactly. I feel like one of the biggest blunders of Obama's first term was not taking advantage of the post-Bush, 2 year honeymoon period he had, when everyone loved him, and the Democrats had control of both houses. Maybe it was his inexperience, but he just didn't push the right issues at the right time, and after that brief window of opportunity had passed, everything he's attempted to accomplish since has been nipped in the bud by the patriotic Republicans, who just love this country so much it hurts, literally.
[–]Mr_Titicaca 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I know this leads to people saying Democrats can't do shit, while Repubs always get shit done. THe thing is Repubs get shit done most of the time cause they vote alone party lines with zero fucks to give. They don't give a fuck what it is, they will unite as one. Democrats on the other hand, for the most part, do what most ppl would do and that's debate and take their own stance. Again, just generalizing here since I know both parties have been shit with NDAA and SOPA. Anyhoo, I rather my representatives be split with their own decisions than follow the blind.
[–]NotKennyG 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
We don't fail to take it into account, it's just bullshit.
He doesn't even try/ If he were putting up a fight and losing I could cut him some slack, but the Republicans barely need to fight him because he just gives them what they (and he) want.
He's made a shitload of bad executive decisions that Republicans have had no control over.
[–]Bob_Munden 20 points21 points22 points 8 months ago
He takes a lot of heat for what other people have done/ what he has no control over. After all, he did wrap up what Bush said he was going to, the War in Iraq. Osama bin Laden was also killed under Obama's presidency (the last time anyone had sights on Osama, was in 2006?, where all but one from a SEAL team was killed, that one was the sniper that had a sight on Osama, but the shot was declined), Gaddafi. There are many other things that have benefited the USA under Obama's presidency, as outlined in the 60 minutes interview. I think his second term will show the US what he is capable of.
[–]tharju 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
dont forget about how Burma has changed--moving toward democratic reform under Obama.
[–]XXLpeanuts 37 points38 points39 points 8 months ago
When looked at from a European perspective, Obamas policies are extremely conservative (that's a bad thing here believe it or not) and I dont agree with a lot of this views (although i reckon a lot of what he says is just what people wanna hear, I dont reckon hes actually a Christian for instance), but when taking into consideration the other possibilities for president being paraded around now, it becomes clear that Obama is clearly the only choice and although if he were running for office here, I would hate him, since he is American I actually love him! Funny old world ent it
[–]DefinitelyRelephant 15 points16 points17 points 8 months ago
He's not nearly belligerant enough to be an American Christian.
[–]mafiastasher 10 points11 points12 points 8 months ago
Implying all American Christians are nutty evangelicals.
[–]DefinitelyRelephant 26 points27 points28 points 8 months ago
Implying that people who believe in invisible skyfathers with nothing more than hearsay and conjecture to support it are anything less than insane.
[–]NFunspoiler 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
He seems like your typical liberal Christian to me. Not everyone wears their religion on their sleeve.
[–]mostlyferal 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
When looked at from an American perspective of a couple decades ago, Obama's policies are pretty conservative, too.
[–]PR-0927 16 points17 points18 points 8 months ago
Good Guy Obama doesn't shove his religion down our throats?
[–]Manwithtie 3 points4 points5 points 8 months ago
If only he had testicular fortitude. If only.
[–]Buzzkill48074 55 points56 points57 points 8 months ago
A lot less talk a little more action Mr President.
Among other things, since taking office Obama has:
Opposed gay marriage in 2009 and reaffirmed his position in 2010. When he finally flipped on his position in 2011 he stated that he was still "grappling" with his personal views on gay marriage.
Signed the NDAA - an indefinite detention bill - into law.
Placed Sanctions on Iran that will likely lead to war.
Increased the TSA’s budget and allowed the scope of their authority to increase
Gave Blackwater a quarter of a billion dollars.
Approved of a more draconian Patriot Act.
Assassinated three American Citizens 1 2 3.
Continued the Drug War. Including pushing for a fiver year mandated sentence for Charles C. Lynch the owner of a licensed medical marijuana dispensary.
Wins right to deny habeas review from detainees.
Protected Bush officials from charges relating to torture.
Waged war on Libya without congressional approval.
Waives health care coverage for employees of 29 companies including McDonald's.
Deports record number of immigrants.
Continued and escalated a covert, drone war in Yemen.
Takes the hardest stance in American history against government whistle blowers.
Escalated the proxy war in Somalia.
Pushes harder for warrantless wire taps than Bush did.
Escalated the CIA drone war in Pakistan.
And what about the Children?
Promises more transparent government denies more FOIA request than Bush.
Gives BP and other big oil companies exemption from EPA laws.
Will maintain a presence in Iraq even after "ending" war.
Sharply escalated the war in Afghanistan.
Secretly made deal to kill health care public option while secretly meeting with health care executives and provided an exemption for abortion.
Secretly deployed US special forces to 75 countries.
Sold $30 billion of weapons to the dictatorship in Saudi Arabia.
Signed an agreement for 7 military bases in Colombia
Appoints multiple lobbyist while signing an executive order limiting this practice. This included lobbyist from Goldman Sachs , Raytheon and Monsanto.
Continued Bush's rendition program.
[–]deadwisdom 15 points16 points17 points 8 months ago
Man you are such a buzz-kill... Oh, carry on.
I tell this same thing to people when they tell me about how great he is...but let's not fuck around, here. He hides these as points of shame; the Republican candidates would wear them as badges of honor.
[–]thesdo 7 points8 points9 points 8 months ago
Why can't we have that Obama back?
And since America is clearly a Christian nation founded on christian principles, this is an attack on Christianity and/or an attempt to keep Christians from having a voice in how laws are made.
And yes, that is sarcasm, just in case some think I'm serious, though there are clearly those who will think along those lines.
[–]TinHao 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
If only we had elected this guy for president instead of the guy we have in there now..
Hey, wait a minute..
[–]spirit_spine 4 points5 points6 points 8 months ago
I wish that guy would run for president in 2012...
[–]A_Pickle 40 points41 points42 points 8 months ago
Like indefinite detention!
[–]weewolf 25 points26 points27 points 8 months ago
Or drug laws.
[–]dementedsnake 41 points42 points43 points 8 months ago
I guess a lot of people here are disappointed in his work, but agree it's a choice between either disappointment or BATSHIT CRAZY! ?
[–]chewybear0 25 points26 points27 points 8 months ago
I regret that I have but one upvote to give for my country president.
He's not perfect, no one is, but maybe as a second term president he'll have more guts to push through real, important legislation that we can be proud of.
[–]Blindweb 4 points5 points6 points 8 months ago
more guts
This concept of lack of guts has no evidence behind it. His goals have always been, and will always be, to increase his power and status in this world, like 99% of politicians. Sometimes I agree with him sometimes I disagree. I never make the mistake of voting for anyone based on character-projections rather than actual policies implemented. He's starting to play to his base in reasonably safe ways before the elections.
[–]snorkedsnorkedsnorke 6 points7 points8 points 8 months ago
open question: are there any pro-life atheists?
the bible says nothing about abortion, but it seems that only religious people are opposed?
[–]InHarmsWay 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Actually I think there was a bible passage about inducing a miscarriage using a drink of sorts in the name of god. I just can't remember which book.
[–]niccig 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
This? - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sotah The trial by ordeal for women suspected of adultery - if she miscarries, then clearly guilty. Yup, sounds like a way for Old Testament men to abort babies that are potentially not theirs.
[–]Trevor1993 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
"Abortion should not only be safe and legal, but rare." -Bill Clinton
Great quote from a great president.
[–]TheRPGAddict 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I am if you could call me that. I think that the term "unborn child" is a real thing and that it is a conflict of rights. Alot of families want to adopt and I think that that option is the better of the two choices. When it comes to giving a woman the choice whether or not she can have an abortion, I think is a tough issue, because it is a pure conflict of rights.
[–]YGOnewguy 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
the problem is he is just a figure head, he doesn't have as much power as the majority of the pubic actually believes he has
[–]LipsLikeMorphyne 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
If only the white house actually followed that principle. They still refuse to do anything about "in god we trust"...
[–]Sarcastimus 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
So, let me get this straight? With the understanding that this is r/atheism, every candidate, EVERY candidate promotes one religion or another, so it seems the general consensus is that most of you will vote for Obama over anyone else? Really? Is the candidates religious background is the only thing you care about? Everyone here sounds like a damn one topic voter....
[–]dierfaker 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
Nothing is as universal as torture thats for sure.
[–]2danimm 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
too bad he turned out to be a selfish corporate whore.
[–]mgwooley 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
Good guy disappointing president.
[–]Murrabbit 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
Now was that before or after he signed the NDAA which gives his administration the authority to arrest and detain US citizens without charges or trial for an indefinite length of time? What sort of universal principle is that based on I wonder?
To be fair though this was already happening in practice. . . but now it's finally legal, haw haw haw, oh goodness isn't the government so wonderfully clever? Now none of them has to go to jail!
[–]freespeed 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
coughBULLSHITcough
[–]OldJeb 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
Obama says a lot of stuff.
[–]fulanitodetal 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
Does this include detainment of any US citizen without a warrant?
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
Well played Obama campaign managers!
[–]vikingspawn 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
Thank goodness he always stands by his word!
[–]Anzai 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
Of course, if you don't pretend to be a Christian then you will never get elected in the first place.
I would love to know the real statistics on which Presidents were faking it for the votes.
[–]unsightlychesthair 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
Obama says a lot of things!
[–]SgtEddieWinslow 54 points55 points56 points 8 months ago
As a Canadian I hope he is voted again.
[–]TooSubtle 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
As an Australian I also agree.
Also, can I please move to Canada?
[–]tbrizzle 19 points20 points21 points 8 months ago
agreed.. also a Canadian here :) no doot aboot it
[–]bluestocking_16 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
As a Filipino, I also wish he gets four more years
[–][deleted] 17 points18 points19 points 8 months ago
Obama's a really smart guy.
[–]juicebox_ 10 points11 points12 points 8 months ago
No matter how much someone might not like his views/politics, you have to admit he really is an intelligent person, as well as extremely well spoken.
Obama is extremely intelligent. He graduated magna cum laude at harvard and was also president of the Harvard Law review. That's kind of a big deal.
[–]MosDaf 3 points4 points5 points 8 months ago
That's really Rawls. In fact, it's ideas that are at the core of the American idea of secular, liberal democracy.
Just for the record, because it's so fashionable on Reddit to say things like "I don't like him, but he's the best we can get," I'll say: I think the guy is great. Not merely the lesser of available evils, but someone who is likely to be looked back upon as a genuinely excellent president if he gets a second term (otherwise, his successor--i.e. Romney--will get credit for the strong economy we'll have in 4 years). He does not pale in comparison to European leaders; there is, in fact, no European leader that I'd take in preference to him. He's a good president, period.
[–]crhylove2 8 points9 points10 points 8 months ago
So how does EITHER justify NDAA?!?!?!?!
[–][deleted] 16 points17 points18 points 8 months ago
Well, that's cute. I wonder if he actually thinks that. Who knows.
[–]retromafia 15 points16 points17 points 8 months ago
The guy was a Constitutional scholar before running for office. I believe he believes it's what the Constitution requires and is consistent with the values of our country. But, I'll admit to basing that belief more on hope than on 1st-hand knowledge of his innermost feelings. [/badatheist]
[–]fuckineverything 5 points6 points7 points 8 months ago
Constitution forbids what the NDAA allows which he signed into law.
[–]Tularemia 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I can at the very least assure you he did say that. I know this because I'm the one who made this image. Here's the original video. Of course, I never have any clue what the man is thinking. He seems to be a pragmatist to a fault.
And on a side note, I feel I've finally made it as a redditor, since people are re-posting something I created (assuming you can call putting somebody else's words on a photo of them that you didn't take "creating something")!
[–]WoollyMittens 8 points9 points10 points 8 months ago
... and by universal principles he means, pandering to corporate interests so blatantly that the American plublic is too dumbfounded to even protest.
[–]captainhaddock 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
What is the "universal principle" that supports infinite detention without evidence or trial, Mr. Obama? What is the "universal principle" that lets you fight an eleven-year war of aggression and occupation in Afghanistan without even making a legal declaration?
[–]nypon 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Obama says a lot. Then does other things
[–]spazz56 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Ron Paul> Barack Obama>>>>> Mitt Romney
[–]matics 4 points5 points6 points 8 months ago
It's too bad he couldn't use logic in passing the NDAA.
So glad I'm a Canadian right now. At least until they pass the Omnibus Crime Bill.
[–]plrbrlvr 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
MAKE HIM ONE OF US
[–]raiders13rugger 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Any info on when he said this? Was this on the campaign trail in '08? Or the '12 campaign trail? Either way, it could just be more empty rhetoric that, whether he truly believes in it or not, he may be unable to stand for.
Note: I support Obama. But the man simply has not lived up to his (admittedly absurdly high) expectations
[–]meatwad75892 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Where I live, agreeing with anything Obama says, even one thing, equals one of two things: 1) Being un-American, or 2) a "terrorist". I hate my location.
He included people with no faith at all. Cant tell if he means it or I just feel special.
[–]UofWLS 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
lol Separation of Church and state didn't you guys learn about this in high school?
[–]anticommon 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I think I know who I'm voting for... but we'll have to see if anything reasonable come up in the next few months.
[–]ribagi 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Is one of his principles the idea of Centralized Government? Because you can't explain the NDAA, SOPA, Enemy Expatriation Act and a whole host of other issues with out the ideology of Centralized Government.
[–]0rgasmo 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Atheists don't really have a choice of who to vote for. Unfortunately, RP would have the southern states determine for themselves what rights people should have (because you know, the south is good at that)
[–]mikeyc252 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
As a Catholic, I agree with this. Quite conveniently, it's the most horrific religious wrongs, like abortion, that don't require religious views to oppose.
[–]throwaway-o 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Ah yeah, of course, he reminds me of the refreshing universal principle of murdering people without trial.
[–]was_funny_yesterday 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
"Universal principles" flies in the face of post-modernism, which is the theoretical foundation of Feminism and Anti-Racism. Behold, the hypocrisy of Reddit!!!!
[–]ccnova 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Fuck all the rest of it. If this President will say this, I will vote for him again.
And then he signs a budget law to give Israel five billion more dollars to continue their holy genocide against Palestine.
[–]Earthwormzim 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
So...a couple of my neighbors were enjoying some mj as I came into my apt building (I could smell it as I walked in). The both of them were on their porch, were fairly quite, laughing here and there, having some sort of conversation. They weren't hurting anyone, and were minding their own business.
They really sound like dangerous individuals, right? Maybe their lives would be improved if we threw them in a cage, like the wild animals that they are, right?
Fuck anyone that is willing to aggress against a peaceful human being and do something as inhumane as throwing them in a cage.
As far as I'm concerned, I don't give a shit about any of your opinions, if you support violent aggression of this sort.
Fuck Obama, and the rest of the drug warriors out there.
[–]TheMonkeyPirate 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Barack Obama
In the terminology used in political science circles (and some related fields), Obama is talking about using so-called "public reasons" in public debates.
[–]nahreddit 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I came here expecting a good conversation about the competing philosophies on public reason... but then I realized that this is r/atheism and I forgot to log in.
[–]Tbunnyacox 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Does this include ndaa? Because I don't believe indefinite detainment without a trial or even being charged with a crime is a principle I can get behind.
[–]boss1000 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
[Citation needed]
I'm not really doubting it, but I want to know if this is from yesterday or 2008.
[–]scrdmnttr 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
You know this is funny because there was a discussion earlier where people were suggesting that Obama is a closet atheist (for political reasons). They might be on to something. I think it's a fantastically progressive statement.
[–]Dakster11 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
So what? He has done nothing to separate church and state, just as he has done nothing in almost every area.
[–]toephue 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Why does everyone think this is such a brilliant statement. it is not even close to logically sound?
So he agrees with the constitution? That's pretty low standards for a President in my view.
[–]mrplow8 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago*
Democracy doesn't demand that, though. What democracy does is allow people to create laws for any reason as long as they can get enough people to agree with them. So if enough people wanted to ban abortion for strictly religious reasons, there's nothing about democracy that would prevent that.
You could argue that the First Amendment prevents it, but that has nothing to do with democracy, and the First Amendment should also prevent the mentioning of God on currency and in the national pledge; yet we all know that that's not the case. The government seems to be fine with ignoring the First Amendment whenever they feel like it.
It's nice that Obama doesn't base what he believes should or shouldn't be a law on his religious beliefs(or at least claims not to), but he certainly doesn't base it on universal principles either. If that were the case, he wouldn't laugh off the idea of legalizing non-violent "crimes" like drug possession/usage and prostitution just because he personally doesn't think that those things should be legal. Also, I don't know what his reasons for being against gay marriage are, if not religious, but this certainly isn't a universal principle either. The idea that marriage should be between one man and one woman is an opinion; not a universal principle.
[–]whfsdude 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
So can we remove "In God We Trust" now?
[–]toobueller 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I read that as, "I'm going to base my decision on my faith, but justify it by finding something in other faiths that support it,"
rather than,
"I'm going to base my decision on sound reasoning and not any religious ideals."
[–]butanal 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
"Obama says" a lot of things...
[–]ABProsper 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
The idea is good but there are no universal principles unfortunately. The assumption that there are such things has probably been the greatest cause of strife since Christendom (roughly)
[–]davidcjackman 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
And therefore we should believe the politician!
[–]hydrogen18 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Thankfully, no one has to worry about a politician living up to anything he or she says. In fact, if a politician says it you can almost guarantee they don't mean it.
[–]yep45 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
His abortion example... if he really believes that life begins at conception, then defending a life is a pretty universal principle.
He's a pretty shitty person if he says "yeah, I believe abortion is ending a life, but i'm not confident in my ability to convince other people, so i'll just let it be"
[–]Jackmack65 2 points3 points4 points 8 months ago
He is the capitulator-in-chief, after all, so fundamentally any position he takes is one he's willing to abandon at the slightest hint of resistance by the Republicans. I've been dismayed by the actions of every President since Nixon (when I was a child), and I have seriously questioned the intentions of many of them, but I have never in my life seen a leader as hesitant, limp, cowardly, damaged, and willing to cave to every bully on the block as this idiot.
He has well and truly fucked us all and fucked the country by essentially guaranteeing that Romney and the Republicans will take over and pack the Supreme Court full of even more monstrous assholes than sit there today. Oh, and while we're at it, fuck YOU, Ruth Bader Ginsburg.
[–]Booblers 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Here is a video of the speech for anyone that is interested. Seems like he stumbles through it a bit.
[–]1edwood79 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Eloquent Cop out, that.
[–]NinjaWithSpoons 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
not bad
[–]sharked 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Money is the only god these politicians worship.
[–]dementedsnake 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Is this what is feels like to be pandered to? My god, it's like flattery but from a guy who can start wars. It's exhilarating.
[–]warwagen 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Politicians will say anything to get elected/reelected. Sadly people will buy his load of crap.
[–]Mr8Manhattan 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
What are these things called? The pictures of people with "good" quotes from them? There should be a separate subreddit for them.
[–]omegax84 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Doesn't matter, passed NDAA.
[–]xNonsense 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
We should probably just violently rebel already.
[–]ech0-chris 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Hmm.. So tell me, what universal principles are there with the NDAA?
[–]kenmaclean 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
"i may be opposed to abortion for religious reasons" numbers 5:12-31 is about giving abortions to women you suspect are having an affair. Q.E.D. bible is for abortion. therefore Obama is either not a strong reader or not a christian. (before you say he only practices the new testament look at Matthew 5:17-19 Don't get me wrong i approve entirely of the quote and of Obama, it's just a bit of a fact check.
[–]thegoods7 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Actions speak louder than words...
Passes NDAA, patriot act and extends tax cuts for the wealthy.
Also sucks on the big cock of the financial industry.
[–]krangksh 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Thank God he said that, because for a minute there I was worried that he was in favour of having "in God we trust" on everything because it appeases the majority religious base, even though it is a blatantly unconstitutional and non-universal principle.
Oh, fuck.
[–]gamedude999 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Yeah, then what's the universal principal against weed?
[–]backyardlion 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
He's a very intelligent man, but he's corrupt as hell. He's a trap, we can't fall for him again.
[–]jzx81 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Here in Australia our prime minister is unmarried and atheist. The public didn't really care, they just got on with life. I cant believe the American public hate atheists so much!
[–]cockyjeremy 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Obama says.. blah blah blah. He's full of shit. I don't believe a word he says. We'll immediately leave the wars when i'm elected, i'll cut the deficit in half. Blah blah blah. Whatever.
[–]Fannypacking 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
If this man dosen't veto SOPA or PIPA he has lost my vote
[–]bionikspoon 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
ok! now that this is settled let's sign NDAA and comment that "my administration won't use this to detain US citizens"
[–]tinychode 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
More like "Buddha Obama", amirite?
[–]Jayx 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
No point in commemorating anything he says...he's a politician, it's all an act.
[–]Union_Sister 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
He is a much better President as a candidate.
I just wish he played as strong a game as he talks...
that said, I will vote for him in the next Presidential election.
[–]felchmonkey 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
NDAA?
[–]1lluminate 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
If only his actions were as reasonable. Im definitely temporarily placated by this quote though!
[–]YoungRL 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
This is all I want in my government, damnit! Okay, maybe not ALL I want, but if we could at least understand this idea, we'd be making leaps in the right direction!
[–]Oggy_Bones 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
He's a politician, he's lying. He must be shot in the dick at once.
[–]tenor3 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
FUCK YES, that last line. "including those with no faith at all."
[–]KingLiberal 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Man, who is this guy? He should be President or something.
[–]john2kxx 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
I don't care if he's a secret atheist or as all-inclusive as he claims to be. He's been nearly as bad as Bush. I voted for him in 2008, and I won't make the same mistake again.
[–]FazedOut 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Oh, so Campaign Obama is back?
Yeah I remember when he was gunning for the nomination he didn't wear a flag pin because he thought it was a cheap, empty move. Campaign Obama is the guy I voted for and was very disappointed to see leave. Now I'm not so happy.
[–]mrzombiecandy 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Gay marriage.
[–]Lord_of_Potatoes 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
This is the guys who wanted to pass the NDAA, him dont believing religion has a place in politics doesnt really make him worthy of praise. I though he was gonna be at least something in the beginning, turns out, he's evil just like most presidents.
I pity Americans now... :/
[–]Ascoeur 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Obama says a lot of things.
[–]Self_Hating_Liberal 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
But... but... RON PAUL
Ron Paul? Ron Paul Ron Paul Ron Paul. Ron Paul.
[–]RogerWaterZ 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Yeah well saying one thing and doing another is what all presidents are good at.
[–]GigaGrey 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
So, after Ron Paul scared away all atheists (and would probably have never become the republican candidate) Obama seems to be the reasonable choice - everyone else is a religious nutjob.
I hope you do the right thing,
Greetings from the old continent.
[–]Ecl1pse 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
Obama says a lot of things...
[–]todaysrubbish 1 point2 points3 points 8 months ago
The words of a lying war criminal should not be listened to.
all it takes is a username and password
create account
is it really that easy? only one way to find out...
already have an account and just want to login?
login
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