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all 125 comments

[–]Katz_Vailo 40 points41 points ago

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What about Leif Erikson Day? Happy Leif Erikson Day HINGGAAA DINGGA DURRGEEEEEEN!!!!!

[–][deleted] 16 points17 points ago

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I'm shamelessly posting this to the top comment because it's one of my favorite quotes, and I want to share it.

“1492. As children we were taught to memorize this year with pride and joy as the year people began living full and imaginative lives on the continent of North America. Actually, people had been living full and imaginative lives on the continent of North America for hundreds of years before that. 1492 was simply the year sea pirates began to rob, cheat, and kill them.”

-Kurt Vonnegut-

[–]zoddness 8 points9 points ago

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Yeah, but those sea pirates later invented the internet. I think it worked out pretty well, in the end.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point ago

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Does this mean we can chop up the British?

[–]XavierMendel -3 points-2 points ago

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I was going to spend Leif Erikson day on reddit, laughing my ass off. But it's scheduled for maintenance. No choice but to go outside and hang with Bubble Buddy. Or...

Is bubble rape a crime?

[–]Supertrinko 3 points4 points ago

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What is this maintenance you speak of?

[–]Chimneyfish 9 points10 points ago

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For the record: the New World had a long history of territorial wars among conquesting tribes and native civilizations doing things like sacrificing innocent people in the name of their extreme religious ideas. There are also diseases such as syphilis that were introduced to Europeans by Native Americans. I'm not justifying anything or saying that the scales are equal, I just think we should stop treating this story like a Disney movie. Native Americans were taking each other's land long before the Europeans ever got there. The main difference seemed to just be that one side had guns.

[–]dokenmoken 0 points1 point ago

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Guns are op, nerf guns. Scumbag Spain, only uses op items.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points ago

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There are also diseases such as syphilis that were introduced to Europeans by Native Americans.

Syphilis is actually the only known one for sure, and it's nowhere near as bad as smallpox.

[–]Chimneyfish 1 point2 points ago

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Yeah I agree, which is why I typed "I'm not justifying anything or saying that the scales are equal." I was referring to the popular misconception that Native Americans lived in some kind of flawless, peaceful Garden of Eden before Europeans got there.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point ago

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Well it doesn't matter who spread the worse diseases or which was worse because the spreading of diseases was 99.9% unintentional (the smallpox blanket shit is considered a myth by historians, there's no record it ever happened.)

You did imply that the natives spread more than one disease to Europeans though and there isn't any evidence for that either.

[–]digeridude 7 points8 points ago

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For the last time, that's a picture of Hernán Cortés.

[–]apextek 33 points34 points ago

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scumbag American, gets born in America, renounces his ancestors for moving to America that created his existence.

[–]thesatsui 7 points8 points ago

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Then refuses others to enter.

[–]capnjack78 4 points5 points ago

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Let's bitch about shit that happened centuries ago. It's been working for us so far.

[–]SirFappleton 1 point2 points ago

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Maybe if we bitch and complain enough, history will change.

[–]KingBeetle 1 point2 points ago

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We could stop repeating it. That'd be something.

[–]DuelingMarimbas -1 points0 points ago

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Or maybe bitching and complaining will convince people to not honor an asshole who didn't do much besides land somewhere half way across the world from where he meant to be.

[–]SirFappleton 2 points3 points ago

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Or maybe bitches can shut the fuck up. Which is technically me bitching about you bitching about others.

[–]DuelingMarimbas 0 points1 point ago

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Meta-bitching is the best kind of bitching.

[–]BJPennFan209 5 points6 points ago

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Well some of us didn't come here willingly

[–]Buzz_Killington_III 2 points3 points ago

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So, the lesson is that the Native Americans had a shitty immigration policy. Got it. Lesson learned.

[–]heyguyswatchthis 39 points40 points ago

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Don't forget to spread diseases and rape the women!

[–]golfjunkie 21 points22 points ago

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And take their gold.

[–]staiano 1 point2 points ago

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They have gold? Awesome!

[–]staiano 0 points1 point ago

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They have gold? Awesome!

[–]maniacnf 0 points1 point ago

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and trim their hedges!

[–]Kane_Train 4 points5 points ago

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Rape and Pillage... Repeat step 1

[–]s0m3f00l 1 point2 points ago

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YEAH! We don't need to rape though can't we just politely start conversations and get them drunk? And then maybe get the sex on if they want too ?

[–]Brace_For_Impact 0 points1 point ago

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Don't forget to pick up some slaves!

[–]Crimms -1 points0 points ago

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And destroy all their herbs and vegetables. Except corn.

[–]AlisonCreates 14 points15 points ago

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Columbus merely discovered it. He did not start the takeover.

[–]kzei 2 points3 points ago

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he did in fact start the takeover. In general I'm opposed to pop-nonfiction, but you should check out Howard Zinn's "The People's History of The United States". Columbus was a bad dude

[–]CallerNumber4 7 points8 points ago*

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He didn't discover it, he popularized it. The Norse had known about North America for several centuries prior to. Columbus is pretty much Reddit to the Norse 4chan.

[–]The_Showdown 5 points6 points ago

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actually, the idea the Chinese made it to the Americas before Columbus has been pretty much debunked. It was an idea spread when an amateur historian wrote a book based on sketchy evidence. Also, if you compare Ming dynasty ships to Columbus era ships, you'll notice that the Chinese engineering is much less advanced and not suitable for cross ocean journeys, especially the pacific which is much larger and more difficult to cross than the Atlantic.

source: http://history.howstuffworks.com/european-history/chinese-beat-columbus1.htm

[–]illiterateninja -1 points0 points ago

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Menzies and the proponents of the 1421 theory say it does exist. In the Pacific Northwest of the present-day United States, investigations at eight different sites have uncovered Chinese coins. A garment from the Nez Perce tribe of present-day Idaho that's dated at over 300 years old has woven ornaments into it that are believed to be Chinese beads. And in the Florida Keys and off the coast of Big Sur, Calif., artifacts of pre-Columbian Chinese jade have been unearthed from a riverbed and the sea floor.

What does this have to do with the Norse discovering the Americas before Columbus?

[–]The_Showdown -4 points-3 points ago

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i wasn't disagreeing about the Norse. They definitely did reach the Americas before Columbus. I was simply addressing the portion of his comment about the idea that early Chinese explorers made it to the Americas before Columbus.

[–]illiterateninja -1 points0 points ago

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He didn't discover it, he popularized it. The Norse had known about North America for several centuries prior to. Columbus is pretty much Reddit to the Norse 4chan.

This is his post.

[–]The_Showdown -1 points0 points ago

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he edited his comment dude. Look at the bottom of your comment. See the edit button? He clicked that, then erased the chinese section. God damn man.

[–]illiterateninja -5 points-4 points ago

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Yes, we both know he edited his comment. I tried to tell you what it it now. You reacted defensively to that. What's your problem?

[–]CallerNumber4 -1 points0 points ago

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It was something I heard floating around, thanks for the information and debunking it.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

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Columbus and his "discoverers" wiped out the entire race of Arowak Indians.

Besides, it had already been "discovered". The arrogance of the West is astounding; I can't believe it's made it's way permanently into history books.

[–]zerro_4 4 points5 points ago

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I don't understand the downvotes you are getting. Europeans introduced diseases that spread incredibly fast and began enslaving the natives of Cuba.

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points ago

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He's getting downvotes because it's ridiculous to call the West arrogant as if every other area lived in peace and harmony before the white man came.

[–]zerro_4 1 point2 points ago

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I would like skroobles to explain what he meant by "arrogant." But I can guess it would be something along the lines that Western history, as told from a Western perspective, as currently presented is arrogant in its assumptions and conclusions.

I don't think skroobles meant that the white man and Europeans fucked everything up everywhere they went. But presenting history in such a way that it was only natural and right that Europeans spread out and colonize is arrogant. Also arrogant in the omissions and whitewashings of mistreatment and abuses of natives and others.

Read this and you will better understand what I am trying to say. History did not, and does not, play out like the narrative presented in schools today.

[–]Testiclese 0 points1 point ago

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The arrogance of the West is astounding

That's what happens when your civilization pretty much becomes the dominant force of the world. You get to write the history books. Sorry. Did you also know that English is the "world" language? That dollars can be used pretty much everywhere? That there's not a single point on this miserable planet that's not reachable by a carrier-borne US fighter jet in something like 15 minutes?

Arrogant? Maybe. But be glad it wasn't the Chinese or Russians who became dominant. Cause if you think Western civilization is being arrogant and revisionist, then, hoo-boy, you ain't seen nothing yet.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points ago

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You seem a little dramatic, and very anti-Chinese/anti-Russian....

Ironic, because the first discoverers of the western worlds were Chinese.

[–]Testiclese 0 points1 point ago

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The fact that we can discuss this freely without fear shows how lucky we are to be part of Western civilization. Do you think it's easy to badmouth China's political leadership in China? Do you think people can just go around saying shit like "Mao was kind of a dick, and Deng was a cooky old man" or "Man, we really should discuss the Tibet situation"?

I may be a bit dramatic, but you sound extremely naive.

I grew up in Eastern Europe when it was still part of the Soviet sphere of influence. You wouldn't last a month there, if you honestly think the West is that horrible. Brother, you haven't seen shit. Shit.

Ironic, because the first discoverers of the western worlds were Chinese.

Not only is there no irony in this case, it's a completely irrelevant fact. That's like me saying "Your comment is very ironic, considering it rained yesterday in Colorado".

[–]The_Showdown 0 points1 point ago

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Ironic, because the first discoverers of the western worlds were Chinese.

damnit I hate this myth. I don't understand why so many people believe this crap. Here, I mentioned this earlier on in this thread. Give it a good thorough read: source: http://history.howstuffworks.com/european-history/chinese-beat-columbus1.htm If this doesn't convince you, I can find you many other well referenced sources that will. The Chinese did not reach North America before Columbus. Either way, the Norse made it before the Chinese.

[–]BAWLing -3 points-2 points ago

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He didn't die in prison for just discovering new land.

[–]Sodfarm 1 point2 points ago

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In fact, he didn't die in prison at all.

[–]ndchristie 1 point2 points ago

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he was held for 6 weeks before being released. he died some 6 years later after making another voyage to the americas and having the whole of his wealth and estate restored (everything but the title of governor).

....and today is the day you learn to google everything you say prior to posting ;-)

[–]thaspaam 15 points16 points ago

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repost

[–]roastedbagel 8 points9 points ago

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I try not to complain but this was on the front page all day two other times this week. Also it seems like r/pics and r/funny has become one giant rss feed from someecard.com

[–]SirColton 4 points5 points ago

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[–]HunterGreen12 0 points1 point ago

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*rapist

[–]I__HATE_YOU 0 points1 point ago

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I hate you (OP). You're not funny. You're not original. Stop posting.

http://www.overcompensating.com/posts/20051010.html

[–]spainguy 4 points5 points ago

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"To prove a legal title to land one must trace it back to the man who stole it" -- David Lloyd George

[–]atlaslugged -1 points0 points ago

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American Indians had no concept of real estate ownership. Many were nomadic or semi-nomadic. You can't steal something that no one owns.

[–]ndchristie 2 points3 points ago

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There's an ounce of truth in this myth, but it's mostly a pile of rubbish. Most native groups did consider themselves administrators of their lands, and disputes frequently arose between them (as with other groups) when things were not done as they desired. For instance, it was understood that building a house on wompanoag land meant adhering to the wompanoag leadership. Hunting and grazing on another group's territory without permission was frowned upon. Early natives were generally tolerant of white settlers, and many customs prescribed the generous treatment of guests, but they did not see them as having authority unless it was agreed upon.

When settlers arrived in the northeast, many of the native groups there had already been greatly reduced by smallpox and other diseases brought by various explorers and fishermen up and down the coast. The Pilgrims in particular settled in land which had been recently forsaken, when over 90% of the patuxet tribe had died a few years earlier, and they detail a number of unoccupied dwellings and unclaimed foodstores, helping give rise to the belief that the Natives were more loose about ownership than was ever true.

Many of the property issues that arose between settlers and native stemmed from inconsistent logic on behalf of the europeans. By their definition, fenced-in land was intended for settlers, while woodlands remained with the natives, which both parties were fine with. But white men would hunt game in the woodlands, which natives saw as disingenuous, and they would allow their cattle to stray into the woods, which was highly destructive. They compared loose cattle breaking things apart, wrecking traps and footpaths and clearing brush (which scattered the various birds and small game living there), to their coming into the fields and turning over crops, breaking gates, etc. Originally on friendly terms, the settlers were inclined to agree with this reasoning, but the first solution (allow the natives to hunt straying cattle) was unthinkable, and the second solution (keep cattle fenced at all times) was highly impractical, leading to an uncomfortable and non-functional series of compromises. A smallpox epidemic came through, wiping out many of the prominent natives and severely reducing the original settlers.

The natives grew bitter at this and the settlers were greatly replenished in numbers with unsympathetic newcomers, leading to increased tensions. The natives, believing that the settlers had overstepped their bounds and claimed unfair privileges, demanded the reduction of settlements and the removal of white settlers from traditional lands, insisting that the whites remain in the outskirts and forsaken areas that they had originally been given. This did not happen, and the result of the failed negotiations was King Philip's War, one of the most horrific wars ever fought on the continent (in terms of population percentages) - a war waged by Natives over their perception of property. They destroyed over 80% of the new towns, and spared only what they perceived as "rightful" settlements (providence proper, newport and western mass) - a policy which ultimately led to their downfall, as the settlers fortified these towns and used them as bases for a series of counter-offensives that would nearly exterminate the remaining natives. All subsequent conflicts initiated by or against native powers (where they were key belligerents, and not merely allies) were over who had a right to live where.

*TL,DR *: the natives did not practice personal ownership of land within a tribe, but very much believed in land ownership, and fought in many bloody conflicts over land ownership.

[–]atlaslugged -1 points0 points ago

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It's not a myth. Land ownership is impossible in the absence of a central deed authority and arbitrator of disputes. What they practiced, and what you exhaustively described, was territoriality, which is fundamentally different from land ownership in the modern sense. You said it yourself:

Hunting and grazing on another group's territory without permission was frowned upon.

It's also important to note that there were many tribes and they didn't necessarily have the same practices.

[–]ndchristie 0 points1 point ago*

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Absence of written language in much of the americas prior to colonial times obviously prevented written documents, but native american law, particularly among the Iroquois and other northern woodland natives was highly developed with regard to land use (and many other things) prior to colonial times and perhaps prior to European discovery, although that remains hotly debated. Arbitration was well-established within and between tribes, and it is for this reason that settling such issues through violence was relatively uncommon as compared to say, dark-age europe. Remember also that to this day, a verbal agreement still holds the full weight of the law, unless contradicted by subsequent agreements or if either party lacked the authority to enter into it. As early colonies in north america recognized the authority of native groups, this was not the case in such agreements. It would be their European sovereigns who refused to recognize these agreements, and who encouraged the expansion and practices which violated them.

What they practiced, and what you exhaustively described, was territoriality

Actually what I've described is Usufruct law, which again was highly developed among the natives that early settlers came into contact with. Tribes maintained clear borders and divided property internally, and had clear systems for how members of the tribe as well as others could use such pieces of land. In this regard, Europeans only introduced individual land ownership (which did not exist within tribes) and the concept of assigning a monetary value to land, which had previously changed hands only through conquest or diplomacy, or as the result of migration (in the case of nomadic tribes) or extinction (in the case of epidemic). Tribal ownership of land was indeed de jure, not merely de facto, as those groups which made semi-permanent settlements maintained ownership of their summer lands during winter, and vice-versa.

As settlers arrived in the northeast and canada, they entered written and verbal agreements with the natives, in many cases recognizing the established laws and land ownership. These are the agreements such as those mentioned allowing settlers to use areas that were agreed upon and reserve the rest for the native groups. For this reason, initial expansion of the colonies in the region was incredibly limited, especially in what would become New York State. Because no native law is known to have considered personal ownership, they did not care which white man held title to which piece of land, so long as it was land that was given for the white man's use. No native group was also known to recognize the sovereignty of European colonists over american lands prior to the 18th century, and as such considered themselves to be the owners and administrators of their traditional lands through the entire period, excepting only those lands which had been abandoned by other tribes. For this reason (among others), they anticipated full compliance with the agreements that they had reached. As more settlers arrived, these were less frequently honored, and things would have come to war far sooner if the natives had not placed their faith in legal processes.

[–]CapnSupermarket 3 points4 points ago*

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Yet they fought with colonists and other tribes over land. They didn't have a county clerk, but they did understand the phrase "my land."

[–]atlaslugged 0 points1 point ago

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Wolves would do the same thing. That doesn't mean they own the land.

[–]Testiclese 0 points1 point ago

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Again with the "noble savage" legend, I see! They weren't just innocent, pure, goddess-moon worshipping children of the land, you know.

[–]atlaslugged 0 points1 point ago

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Huh? I used neither "noble" nor "savage."

[–]Testiclese 0 points1 point ago

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[–]187lennon 2 points3 points ago

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Plan a trip and use the wrong distances for all points of references. If done correctly, you should run out of supplies and die halfway. If done very correctly, you will stumble upon a previously undocumented source of supplies halfway, go back home, and say you totally got where you were going. If you decide to take this "mysterious oasis" route, you will need to make sure that it is absolutely nothing like your intended destination.

[–]I_have_BPD_sorry 2 points3 points ago

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Nice, sarcastic posts about holidays aren't old or unoriginal.

[–]stunnedboss 5 points6 points ago

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and INSIST on calling them by somebody else's name..

[–]Misterjd 3 points4 points ago

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This is the 4th time I've seen this reposted.

[–]otakuman 1 point2 points ago

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That's not Columbus, that's Hernán Cortés.

[–]BuhDerpDerp 1 point2 points ago

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Is this a shot at the Italians or Americans?

[–]Fuqwon 1 point2 points ago

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Fun fact - Columbus wasn't Italian.

[–]seranikas 1 point2 points ago

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what about THIS

[–]aszy 1 point2 points ago

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[–]werko 1 point2 points ago

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Daamn! it has been 364 days since I read this last. Time goes so fast!

[–]boostmane 1 point2 points ago

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TIL: Israel is an homage to Columbus.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points ago

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To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women.

[–]cachinnate 1 point2 points ago

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ಠ_ಠ

[–]Lonelan 3 points4 points ago

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Or by showing up in Africa and saying "hooray! India!"

[–]ThJ 6 points7 points ago

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I heard that in Zoidberg's voice. I laughed.

[–]LibertariansLOL 2 points3 points ago

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Can't wait for another day when self-hating 19 year old liberals bash america.

it'll be like r/politics all over reddit!

[–]derphoenix 3 points4 points ago

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Meanwhile in Israel...

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago*

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Ha! It's funny because America isn't an Imperialist occupier anymore.

Is there a Godwin's-type law for Israel?

[–]JasonWin 1 point2 points ago

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Don't be silly, tomorrow is Thanksgiving.

[–]laserfire 2 points3 points ago

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If you up-arrow this thread, you are killing original content.

[–]Chair001 1 point2 points ago

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Wow nice repost.... Gtfo downvote you get from me.

[–]DukeOfGeek 0 points1 point ago

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If you are going to do that at my house it would be use full to have 3 frigates and the compliments of marines that go with them.

/use full = survivable.

[–]PedanticWaffle 0 points1 point ago

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Not an uncommon pastime for me, but I suppose I'll just work extra hard...

[–]gdoubleod 0 points1 point ago

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I dunno as an Italian American I always felt like Colombus day was a day celebrating italian americans not just Colomubs. The Irish American have St. Patty's day... maybe we could just rename the day? I think they tried to rename it Native American day at one point... which I would be fine with as long as they gave the Italian American a day as well... dunno maybe I'm asking for too much...

[–]Mercury756 0 points1 point ago

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So I take it you're opposed to illegal immigration then?

[–]vebent 0 points1 point ago

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Did that more than 2 years ago. It's called renting.

EDIT: The banks also do that to all of their customers that have mortgages.

[–]k3z0r 0 points1 point ago

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How can we incorporate this into occupy wall street?

[–]maniaq 0 points1 point ago

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isn't there some /r/usa or something you can post this shit in?

[–]faerrua 0 points1 point ago

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don't forget the rape

[–]Shitballs1 0 points1 point ago

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How many fucking times am I going to see this dumb ass picture

[–]wkdown 0 points1 point ago

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[–][deleted] 0 points1 point ago

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Don't forget to bring slavery and infection, too.

[–]hitlerwasright 0 points1 point ago

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In iraq, every day is columus day.

Support our troops

[–]sicktaker2 0 points1 point ago

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At the reservation where I work, they turned the entire weekend before into Indian day, which is the big event on their reservation. Kind of a whole weekend of partying and celebrating their culture that ends with, "Then some white guy sailed up, and it's been downhill ever since."

[–]oldude 0 points1 point ago

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Damn...if that C4 charge had just sunk more than the Santa Maria!!

-Orson Scott Card, Pastwatch

[–]JuJuMountainMan 0 points1 point ago

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Haha! oh colonial Spain, you rapey empire.

[–]andrey_shipilov 0 points1 point ago

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Actually, the usual everyday American lifestyle.

[–]lauranater007 0 points1 point ago

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Win.

[–]SGuard15 0 points1 point ago

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[–]jesseboy000 0 points1 point ago

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Chris fucking sucked, what an ass.

[–]CozzyZ 0 points1 point ago

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Columbus never landed in North America

[–]misuses_catchphrases 0 points1 point ago

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Following that logic: in Israel every day is columbus day! Badum-DISH!

[–]leicanthrope 0 points1 point ago

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Yes, but 16th century German mercenaries (one of which is pictured on the meme) had very little to do with 15th century exploration...

[–]parallelpolygon 0 points1 point ago

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Reposts. Reposts everywhere.

[–]I-DOWNVOTE-YOU 0 points1 point ago

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How about we celebrate jeffAA day by sucking cock and being a pathetic faggot fucktard all day instead?

[–]UnicornsPoopSkittles 0 points1 point ago

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This applicable to Thanksgiving as well!

[–]TitaniumShovel 0 points1 point ago

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I feel like I see this image once every year on Columbus Day. Must remember to post this next year to reap in the karma.

[–]deathbytray 0 points1 point ago

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I'm celebrating Columbus day by breaking my GPS and getting completely lost.

[–]finalaccountdown -1 points0 points ago

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This should be a Jewish holiday too in that case.

[–]wohl0052 -3 points-2 points ago

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*and then committing genocide, don't forget that

[–]Gargoame -4 points-3 points ago

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And give them blankets. With smallpox.

[–]izakk1220 -2 points-1 points ago

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How about instead we walk into someones house 4th, think we're in a house on the opposite side of the world, get praised for being the 1st there, take all the gold and men as slaves back to our house, then have a national holiday named after us. Yeah, that's a bit more accurate...

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points ago

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thats a lot of hate to dump on one italian guy.

do you have the same contempt for the spaniards that hired him or his mostly spanish crew ?

http://www.columbusnavigation.com/crew.shtml

its cool these days to hate on him because we have the benefit of hundreds of years of education and research with which to frame the entire time period.

try thinking about it this way. what if the mars rovers brought an organism to mars that killed off the entire planet's population of life ? some form of life we didnt realize was there or know how to deal with.

would you pat yourself on the back and say "well, we didnt mean to and we had good intentions"

fucking hipster armchair pundits thinking they understand the world

[–]shhhhhhhhh -4 points-3 points ago

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Wait, so are you implying the genocide was an "oops, my bad, got some disease on these blankets"?

[–]Creflo -2 points-1 points ago

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More like kicking a handful of squatting bums out of some primo real estate and building the most kick-ass property in the neighborhood.

[–]CCMSTF -4 points-3 points ago*

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Columbus landed in Palestine?

EDIT Stupid Columbians, stop down voting me!

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

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Someone needs to make a law similar to Godwins law. I think things go to Israel quicker than Nazi's.

[–]tofu_bacon -1 points0 points ago

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Only thing good about Columbus day is the store sales. Got a new phone for free today. EEEZ NICE