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top 200 commentsshow 500

[–]mikecngan 49 points50 points ago

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[–]NomadNorCal 4 points5 points ago

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Thanks! Zooming in on the OP's pic, it looked Photoshopped. It's nice to see it wasn't.

[–]Disco_Drew 33 points34 points ago

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Oddly enough, if there was something about being gay along with the sacrifice, the comments would have a completely different tone.

[–]ObamaisYoGabbaGabba 15 points16 points ago

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yea, everyone here would be cheering him...

[–]bloobloobloo 435 points436 points ago

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HE REALLY LOVES HALLIBURTON I GUESS

[–]thestraylightpun 152 points153 points ago

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I'm in the military, and this made me crack up.

I'm a horrible person.

[–]iupetre 55 points56 points ago

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I don't think it makes you a terrible person. I think it makes you honest.

[–]optimister 3 points4 points ago

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I laughed too, but it stopped as soon as I thought about the guy behind the tattoo...

[–][deleted] ago

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[deleted]

[–]thestraylightpun 14 points15 points ago

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My old piss-mate (our dorms shared a bathroom) was like that. One time, I forgot to lock the door to his side, and while I was taking a shit he strolls in buck naked with a raging hard-on and a 2 liter bottle of Mt. Dew, starts up the shower, takes a drink, and then strolls back out. He then left the shower running for a good hour before he got in, from the sounds of things.

Fucking strange kid.

[–]Manocean 21 points22 points ago

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It's because he wanted the noise of the shower running to drown out the sound of him watching porn, he would then clean off in the shower after.

[–]TurnerJ5 7 points8 points ago

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Every male that just read this said to themselves, "Well, duh."

[–]thestraylightpun 4 points5 points ago

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Went right over my head at the time.

But still, he was just chilling at full mast like nothing was amiss.

[–]Sir_Knumskull 1 point2 points ago

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Yeah, xbox 247 sucks. It's like almost 115 worse than the 360.

[–]hpymondays 20 points21 points ago

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ouch

[–]C0debreak 1 point2 points ago

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Either I'm really tired or I just don't get it.

Explain please?

[–][deleted] ago

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[deleted]

[–]skysdiver 12 points13 points ago*

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Halliburton is not a defense company. It's oilfield services corporation.

Edit: it doesn't mean it is good.

[–]captainAwesomePants 47 points48 points ago

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Fine, but that doesn't stop it from collecting half a bilion dollars of DoD contracts.

[–]VivaKnievel 9 points10 points ago

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KBR was a Halliburton subsidiary until 2007.

[–]flyingcarsnow 1 point2 points ago

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they also do laundry and deliver soda

[–]Xcaliber_2276 1 point2 points ago

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KBR is a Halliburton spin off that services the military. He's wrong/right.

[–]C0debreak 2 points3 points ago

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Thank you. :)

[–]EricTboneJackson 229 points230 points ago

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Thank God for the idealism of youth, or the oil tycoons would have no lives to throw away.

[–]faqbastard 28 points29 points ago

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At home we fight over cutting the deficit. Talk of cutting spending on schools and health care while we spend billions daily in other countries on sustaining the military industrial complex. Infuriating. And most in power are afraid to call out the military.

[–]bmike210 8 points9 points ago

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I'd just like to point out that there are actually tremendous budget cuts happening in the military. For instance the US Army is phasing out 10 brigades. That amounts to about 30000+ individuals.

[–]Khatib 7 points8 points ago

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That doesn't necessarily equate to less spending, just more opportunity for corporate profit by picking up lucrative government contracts to fill all those personnel gaps.

2009 WSJ article: Afghanistan Contractors Outnumber Troops

The number of military contractors in Afghanistan rose to almost 74,000 by June 30, far outnumbering the roughly 58,000 U.S. soldiers on the ground at that point. As the military force in Afghanistan grows further, to a planned 68,000 by the end of the year, the Defense Department expects the ranks of contractors to increase more.

The military requires contractors for essential functions ranging from supplying food and laundry services to guarding convoys and even military bases -- functions that were once performed by military personnel but have been outsourced so a slimmed-down military can focus more on battle-related tasks.

[–]bmike210 10 points11 points ago

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That article was from 2009. The military cuts are new as of this year. Source Two Three

[–]Khatib 1 point2 points ago

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My point is that a smaller military does not equate directly to less spending. They could just be making up the smaller numbers by increasing dependence on third party contractors.

[–]Original_Woody 3 points4 points ago

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I don't doubt that troops and brigades are being pahsed out and cut, I do doubt DoD budget cuts overall. More of a reallocation of funds than decreasing military spending.

[–]I_make_things 17 points18 points ago

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His name is Kyle Hockenberry.

He lost both legs above the knee and his left arm above the elbow.

[–]merrickx 1 point2 points ago

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He's pretty lucky. My friend lost both legs and an arm just as you described, but died on the helo out.

[–]muayguy 5 points6 points ago

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that really sucks specially for a guy so young...hopefully the gov will compensate the shit out of him for sending him to invade another country.

[–]Agnostix 2 points3 points ago

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hopefully the gov will compensate the shit out of him for sending him to invade another country.

You don't know how all that works, do you?

[–]muayguy 1 point2 points ago

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please enlighten me, master

[–]Agnostix 1 point2 points ago

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I am a master of nothing.

What I can tell you is that the government doesn't 'set you up' after you come home wounded from battle.

What's going to happen here is that this soldier will get his purple heart and receive an honorable medical discharge (most likely).

Beyond that, he'll get disability payments on par with anyone else who gets hurt on the job.

There are stories after stories after stories of wounded veterans getting shit on by the same government they fought for. It's astounding.

Don't con yourself into thinking the US government has any kind of 'heart' whatsoever.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

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Well he'll be thought highly of on Veterans day... probably the fourth of July and maybe even Memorial day. That should be payment enough. The other 362 well he's on his own.

[–]GradualPoet 6 points7 points ago

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LOL

[–]rmm45177 1 point2 points ago

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I can imagine this was the response of the same politicians that want to keep this war going.

This would be funny if it wasn't so sad at the same time.

[–]greenwizard 1 point2 points ago

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Yeah, that's a shame -- but have you seen KBR's profits this quarter? They're AMAZING!

[–]waspbr 50 points51 points ago

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“The mark of the immature man is that he wants to die nobly for a cause, while the mark of a mature man is that he wants to live humbly for one”

- Wilhelm Stekel

[–]tutts51 5 points6 points ago

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The goal is not to die for a cause, but to fight for one.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

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That's nice but sometimes a mature man will stand up for what he believes in even if it costs him his life. A coward will blindly accept his fate.

[–]erusackas 8 points9 points ago

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I'm sure the sentiment is shared by people he's fighting.

[–][deleted] 29 points30 points ago

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“Naturally the common people don’t want war. But after all, it is the leaders of a country who determine the policy, and it’s always a simple matter to drag people along whether it is a democracy or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. This is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and for exposing the country to danger. It works the same in every country.”

- Reich Marshall Hermann Goering, during the Nuremberg trials (remark made privately in a conversation with prison psychologist and U.S. Army Captain Gustave M. Gilbert)

[–]againyoufool 24 points25 points ago

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...in Afghanistan

[–]ChrisFingaz 18 points19 points ago

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[–][deleted] 7 points8 points ago

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NOT FOR THOSE I'VE NEVER SEEN

r.i.p.

[–]timklotz 3 points4 points ago

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At least a few people picked up on it.

[–]ChrisFingaz 3 points4 points ago

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yeah I actually saw the others after I posted this and gave them an upboat. Great band.

[–]brettjerk 1 point2 points ago

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fingaaaaaaaz

[–]cudel 1 point2 points ago

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glad someone posted it before i did

[–]nycer 1 point2 points ago

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I thought the same thing.

[–]elneillio 0 points1 point ago

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I came here to say this.

[–]dalittle 34 points35 points ago

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this is where the ideal and reality diverge. Is he protecting the US? Nope. Is he fighting an unnecessary war to make a few people richer? Yes. Our troops deserve better.

[–]Tacodude 70 points71 points ago

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Military related post? Time to tell everyone about how I hate the military!

[–]ChooserofParagon 13 points14 points ago

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I don't hate the military. I hate political power-seekers!

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points ago

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It's not the military by itself, it's blind patriotism.

[–]MerelyIndifferent 3 points4 points ago

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Post about a controversial topic? Better make a comment pointing out the most common opinion I can think of to make it seem like I'm some genius that has uncovered the deepest inner workings of the reddit psyche and that people don't actually have those opinions, they are just slaves to hivemind.

We thank you sir. You've done us all a great service.

[–]malev 6 points7 points ago

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I served in the military not because I had any burning notion of patriotism or a desire to smite the evil muslims, but because it was a profession, a job. A job I was very good at.

If I had been killed, I sure as shit would not want any national attention calling me a hero (unless I had been killed saving kids from a burning orphanage or something neato like that). I would have died doing my job, a job a volunteered for. A job that 95% of Americans can't do. Thats where my sense of pride comes from.

[–]zeelaw 2 points3 points ago

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No offense but I think many people can be soldiers.... More like 5% of them can't do it...

I'm being serious.

[–]Legends_Never_Die 3 points4 points ago

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Not true. Most Americans don't even meet the physical requirement to serve in the military, much less the mental fortitude required of certain jobs.

[–]havesometea1 94 points95 points ago

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sacrificed for nothing

[–]diaperedpupp 2 points3 points ago

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I really do understand how the wars we are in are pointless, but a soldier's service is anything but. A soldier volunteers so that you have the choice not to volunteer. That's what some would call a sacrifice.

[–]circlejerkers-unite 33 points34 points ago

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yea man. totally

btw, dont you hate it when conservatives say those simplistic one liners like "support our troops", without actually making any arguments?

anyway i just wanted to say- "stop the wars" and "theyre fighting for oil/CORPORATIONS!@!!".

[–][deleted] 21 points22 points ago

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Support our troops is meant to convey compassion and support for those serving, not support for the conflict itself ("Support our Conflict" would make a great satirical bumper sticker).

You're probably not old enough to remember this but when our solders came home from Vietnam they were vilified as baby killers and village burners. While some of that may be true you can't paint people in such broad strokes. Us old enough to remember hope to god we never see that again and it looks like it's working.

[–]JediApprentice 4 points5 points ago

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I'm in the army. Infantry. Thank you for making this distinction.

[–]gmbel 7 points8 points ago

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Also, "Never Forget" is simply an admonition to remember that we were attacked by foreign terrorists on 9/11. It implies absolutely nothing about supporting our continuing adventures in Iraq, Afghanistan, etc., or any attitudes about those having Islamic beliefs or Arab ethnicity.

It's important that we acknowledge these things.

[–]patssle 20 points21 points ago

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We've gone from vile hatred to complete worship.

There needs to be a middle ground. Many troops did not sign up to serve, they signed up because they had no direction or career and needed money for school.

[–]usfdude223 8 points9 points ago

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I also have to agree that the "worship" is too much. I am tired of hearing "thank you for your service". There are cooks in the military....that's all they do is cook. The same job as a cook at say a school cafeteria. You'll hear the word hero thrown around for every person in the military. Growing up on an air force base, there are plenty of people whom are just paper pushers, will never be in harms way, and yet they are thanked for service, and considered hero's. It really weakens the word hero in my opinion.

[–]reapreek 5 points6 points ago

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Not to insult anyone, but is it really heroic to kill other people? What about murdering someone whose understanding of life came from living a really shitty part of the world is heroic? Couldn't we say that them killing US soldiers is also heroic?

This is an honest question and I could totally see how it might piss someone off.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points ago

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I don't think just the act of killing people is heroic, but in the right circumstances it can be. There are air force pilots who live in Kansas and flew B-2 stealth bombers over to Europe, refueled in mid-air, bombed Afghanistan, refueled again, and flew home. They slept in their beds at home with their families, and when they killed people, they did it by pressing a button. That isn't heroic. They aren't a whole lot braver in that action than a commercial airline pilot is.

However, a soldier who risks his life to protect his compatriots is a hero. Killing enemies is usually a part of that, but the bravest soldiers to me are those who have disregarded their own safety to save the lives of their fellow soldiers.

[–]thethought 7 points8 points ago

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Outside of a few really oddball liberals, most Americans have come to greatly appreciate the service of our soldiers. The problem is no longer that soldiers get supported, the problem is that in an effort to "support" them we're justifying long, expensive, and deadly wars that are leading to more and more deaths. While I do believe there has been justification for Afghanistan, the same cannot be said of Iraq, and, with the death of Bin Laden, and the reality that Al Queda in Afghanistan is dramatically weakened, what exactly are we fighting for there right now?

The battle against terrorism isn't unfolding in Afghanistan, the front lines have moved to Yemen, Pakistan, Nigeria, and Somalia.

The fact that these criticisms cannot be raised without someone shouting, "but you don't support the troops!" is an in-your-face demonstration of how perverted that idea has become.

[–]circlejerkers-unite 1 point2 points ago

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man, i dont doubt that. but i see people abusing "support our troops" to win an argument about the conflict , all the time. thats what im against. (dude, youre making me break character!)

[–]cryptk 1 point2 points ago

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You can't. To provide an example, nobody can say that every single nazi soldier that ever served under the Reich were bad either. I'm sure there were compassionate individuals in them, and that the only reason they joined was that otherwise they'd have been shot. And i'm not comparing the american army to the Nazis. I'm just saying, broad strokes are required when you deal with things of such magnitude. I'm not saying that most of the soldiers are bad. Quite the contrary, every american person I know are very, VERY nice people(I'm not american nor am i from there, but i've met a fair few). But the conflict is that of baby killing and village burning. And as such, till there's a revolution that stops this, the strokes from the rest of the world WILL be broad.

[–]lobsterknuckles 2 points3 points ago

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I don't think it's limited to conservatives that say one liners with no point.

[–]hitlerwasright 6 points7 points ago

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Sacrificing other people's children

[–]havesometea1 7 points8 points ago

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I will sacrifice the one's you love.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

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The U.S. does not have a mandatory service requirement or an active draft. The only way he could have entered the service is to volunteer.

In his eyes he is making the right choice to serve and protect the ones he loves, even if you disagree you can have respect for his decisions.

[–]Ym4n 2 points3 points ago

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There's no need to sacrifice... keep loving them, don't hurt those you love with your sacrifice.

[–]eMigo 13 points14 points ago

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I read that as "For Those I Love I Will Scarface".

[–]LORDJEW_VAN_CUNTFUCK 4 points5 points ago

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I compared your post to the title at least four times before realising yours said "Scarface".

[–]redditmademegiggle 1 point2 points ago

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Hahahaha, I did too. I spent about 2 minutes looking at the spelling. "That says fucking sacrifice, idiots." Take another look at the title.. Oh.

[–]Infuriated 9 points10 points ago

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Its as if people don't even think anymore. They just get so caught up in emotionalism that they don't take even a second to analyze a situation. I feel for this guy... that he thinks sacrificing himself at all is somehow for the benefit of anyone but the war-mongering elite.

Win-lose mentality will be the death of our species. How do we open people up to the idea that zero-sum games NEED to become a thing of the past!?

[–]hitlerwasright 13 points14 points ago

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If there's one thing I can't stand, it's someone with a victim mentality.

[–]j_lane 5 points6 points ago

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lyrics from new york hardcore band indecision.

[–]fr3ddie 52 points53 points ago

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I love my family... therefore I should invade another country.

[–]mind404 17 points18 points ago

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Yeah, I'm sure he said just that...

[–][deleted] 39 points40 points ago

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Worse. He did just that.

[–]mind404 19 points20 points ago

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oh right, because individual soldiers control this war...
You can disagree with the politics, but don't you dare try to blame those who are willing to serve their country. Take it up with those directing the country.

[–]Tokugawa 3 points4 points ago

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War is over (if you want it).

[–]rarrar 4 points5 points ago

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Individual soldiers control their activity in the war. They don't have to join, but they do, sometimes based on this logic.

[–]mind404 1 point2 points ago

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So do you think he loved, would and did sacrifice for his squad mates? I would be very confident in saying a strong part of that extended to them. In this case I see nothing at all wrong with his 'statement'.

[–]rarrar 1 point2 points ago

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That's not a common response to the question of "who are you fighting this war for?" But you said individual soldiers don't control the war, and they do, in their way.

[–]mrsmunson 5 points6 points ago

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You don't think that if these individuals stopped volunteering and the military were forced to rely on a draft, that people would rethink whether they really believe this war is one worth fighting?

[–]tieren 5 points6 points ago

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That is more representative of a problem with the citizens of the US than those that volunteer to join the military. It is a "If my son/daughter isn't fighting, then who cares" mentality, and if we had a draft then everyone would be more opposed to the idea of invading another country. I don't understand how that would be the soldiers' fault.

[–]r0cky 4 points5 points ago

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Right, but there would be no war, if noone went.

[–]jerperp 13 points14 points ago

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And if noone volunteered to go, there would be another draft. Would that make it better?

[–]Melner 15 points16 points ago

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Yes. With a draft war is harder to wage. Draftees can still refuse.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points ago

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Yes actually, because if there was a draft the politicians' children would also be at risk for going to war. I wonder if the politicians would still be as war-happy.

Currently, it's mostly the poor, aka: young men Washington doesn't give a shit about.

[–]Melner 10 points11 points ago

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No, there would be exceptions galore that would fit most politicians' children. And if not, they still wouldn't be on the front line.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points ago

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Perhaps, but it's not just politicians, it's everyone in power and everyone who votes them into power.

There's a reason we left the draft after Vietnam. They figured out that there are enough desperate people who will sign up, especially if you sell the idea of heroism and "be all that you can be" and WMDs...

[–]Melner 1 point2 points ago

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Yes, that's why people shouldn't support the troops, to counteract the general ignorance.

[–]fuglystick 1 point2 points ago

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OH, the naivete on Reddit is so disheartening.

Hey, you're going to be late for your Poli-Sci class if you don't hurry!

[–]lumpy1981 1 point2 points ago

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I feel like such naive, simplistic, meaningless comments such as the one you just made should be started at -100 karma.

[–]Joeygforce 1 point2 points ago*

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After ten years of running around Iraq and Afghanistan, those that enlist or reenlist I start to take issue with. When this all started I would never blame the troops for any matters, however after this long I'm starting to blame the troops themselves and everyone else that wants to keep up this engagements.

The kid that graduated high in spring of 2001 decides to join the Army and ends up in Afghanistan after 9/11, I'll throw on a yellow ribbon for. The kid that graduated from high school in the spring of 2011 and goes to Afghanistan now, I think does hold some amount of blame. Because they know fully well what those that are directing this country are doing with the endless war, and are serving that.

EDIT misspelling.

[–]mind404 1 point2 points ago

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And I upvote you because that is an honest consideration. My response: So what is your Afghanistan solution that involves no foreign military forces and does not let the Taliban regain control?

This diverts though from my main focus of, don't mock this kid (what I believed the original comment I replied to was doing) because he is willing to sacrifice for those around him, mock the government you disagree with.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

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involves no foreign military forces and does not let the Taliban regain control?

Who fucking cares if Taliban regains control? They have zero quarrels with us once we leave. They don't do international terrorism. Taliban is not same as Al-Qaeda. Terrorism is thing we can handle using FBI, CIA and special forces. We should secure our borders and stay away from the Middle East and Asia.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points ago

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We liked the Taliban enough to have them come to the white house and right up until Bush decided it was time to make some war profits we didn't have much beef with them.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points ago

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More meat for the meat grinder.

[–]MerelyIndifferent 8 points9 points ago

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Other side:

Those I do not love, I will kill.

[–]Phasa 4 points5 points ago

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Both legs above the knee and his left arm above the elbow have been amputated

he's not dead, just very screwed

[–]FrostByt 2 points3 points ago

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Yes, isn't war grand? How about that oil?

[–]Dranzerk 6 points7 points ago

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How exactly is he sacrificing because of love?

[–]bluegoon 1 point2 points ago

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Can someone here explain, what differentiates being American, being an American Patriot, what is the difference between that person, and someone else?

[–]g1bb0n 1 point2 points ago

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'Patriot' is a term that has been used since before the invention of Uncle Sam, in order to rile people up to do the bidding of their ruling elite. The word brings out emotions that blind logic, so the average citizens can agree with what they hear on the news.

[–]malev 1 point2 points ago

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I served in the military not because I had any burning notion of patriotism or a desire to smite the evil muslims, but because it was a profession, a job. A job I was very good at.

If I had been killed, I sure as shit would not want any national attention calling me a hero (unless I had been killed saving kids from a burning orphanage or something neato like that). I would have died doing my job, a job a volunteered for. A job that 95% of Americans can't do. Thats where my sense of pride comes from.

[–]hedeman 1 point2 points ago

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It's a rare picture. Nowdays they strictly do anything to prevent publishig any US casualty pictures. Bad for the morale and recruitment. Well, there's not much blood and gore in this one eighter. They learned their lesson with media in Vietnam. Taking a picture of a soldiers coffin will get you fired. Taking a picture of a head shot US soldier will get you to Gitmo.

[–]g1bb0n 1 point2 points ago

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TIL that there are soldier who love the super rich enough to die for them.

[–]rutkiskacsa 44 points45 points ago

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http://www.stripes.com/calm-in-the-midst-of-chaos-is-lifesaving-protocol-for-medevac-crew-in-southern-afghanistan-1.153257

You know, it took me about five minutes to call the European Stars office in Kaiserslautern, Germany, where the photographer that took this picture is assigned. She is in Afghanistan working as a reporter but also does some photography. I spoke with another person in her office, who sent me the link for the Stars and Stripes article above. He also forwarded her a link to the Marietta Times article, and to this thread, though I told him not to bother her with such small minded, hateful comments. As you can see in the Stars and Stripes article, the second picture in the slide show is a higher quality version of this picture.

It's so disgusting to me, a person that has actually been to war and has actually sacrificed something for his country, to see the behavior of some of you selfish, pretentious, holier-than-thou pampered ingrates that have never lifted a finger except to vomit your vitriol from the anonymous safety of the internet. You, who have never been outside the comfort of your college campus and the security of your fellow angsty faux revolutionaries have the audacity to call those of us who preserve your liberty ignorant slaves to a capitalist empire. You are beneath contempt.

[–]Metaphoricalsimile 36 points37 points ago

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Ex-military here. It disgusts me how little this man's sacrifice actually was for his loved ones.

[–]DZ302 2 points3 points ago

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I agree, I'm ex-military and although not American (I'm Canadian), it is still someone sacrificing for their country. This is what people seem to forget, they are doing their country a service for their country regardless of what the mission is. Perspective can be a little warped since now most know what they are signing up for, but I still think you should blame your politicians and never the troops.

[–]cyberslick188 15 points16 points ago

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Tell me what American soldiers are currently protecting me from.

Just one thing, please tell me.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points ago

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I've been to Afghanistan. Twice. Once as a brand new private and most recently as a buck sergeant team leader. Do I believe that you, cyberslick188, are being threatened directly by the insurgents that fired at myself and my section on a daily basis? No. Does the majority of the brittle infrastructure of the insurgent network currently pose an impending threat to you? Probably not.

I'm more than willing to take the heat from anyone here that has differing opinions, believe me I've been called worse and been treated worse. But I do honestly believe my job does mean something. No matter how ill fated and misguided the majority of us (the military general population) may seem to you, I want you to know that at least on my behalf I would gladly lay my life down in defense of yours.

Regardless of whether or not you believe me, or anyone else here does...it's the honest to god truth for me. It's a calling for me. If I am sent to war in another country, then so be it. It's something that comes with my job. I pray the day never comes that our standing army is called upon to defend the land that our great country lives and breathes on. But should that day ever come, I will answer that call as well and be there to fight to defend what means most to me.

If all of that makes me a blind and ignorant fool, then I guess that's what I am and it's all I'll ever be.

I like to believe that the mere existence of our standing army provides a blanket of protection for our country to deter would-be threatening adversaries from attacking our borders. If it seems like I'm tooting my own horn, I apologize. I don't mean to glamorize myself or my chosen profession. I simply wanted to give you an insight into the mind of someone who honestly and truly believes in the well being of his country and her people.

I appreciate the discussions here and I'm glad to see so many people with so many differing opinions. I'd be more than willing to continue talking with any of you about this subject.

[–]cyberslick188 4 points5 points ago

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Thank you for a calm and rational response. I have no doubt that many soldiers would indeed lay their life on the line for another person, but why the military?

Couldn't you get that same satisfaction and accomplishment from being a police officer, or a firefighter, or an EMT or something else of that nature? I don't think anyone would disagree that we could use a few more police officers with moral fortitude. I personally believe all of those have a higher tangible benefit.

I too believe a standing army is necessary for practically any country with something to lose, and I certainly wouldn't advocate getting rid of it.

There are many corruptions in the US military, and that's an indisputable fact. Much of our economic crisis stems from unbridled defense spending, and downright malicious corporations taking advantage of it. Military, and especially patriotism, is too often a rallying call for people wanting to taking advantage of our country for their own personal gain. The issues with military itself are clear, and most people project that same negative emotion (however justified or not) onto soldiers. We can't easily go yell at Petraeus, McChrystal, Bush, Rumsfeld, Cheney etc, but we can easily go bitch at that the nearest enlisted man, and for that I'm sorry.

But I do believe at the end of the day, in a small way, you are supporting a system that does more negative than positive. The major points of contention that really rile me up personally isn't servicemen in general, it's the small list of commonly used tactics of debating:

  1. I am protecting your freedom and rights. No, soldiers, you are not. Our freedom has not been threatened (by a source worth being worried about anyway) for a LONG time. The only persons seriously jeopardizing our freedoms are right at home. You are not fighting for my personal freedom. You have not fought for my right to free speech, or any other right. You have fought for very little that affects me positively. You HAVE fought however, to keep a for-profit war machine running smoothly, whether you did so voluntarily, or tangentially is irrelevant.

  2. You do not have the courage to do what I am doing, and therefore your opinion is misplaced anger: It does take a level of courage to risk your life (although as I've said earlier, I'm much more likely to risk my own life just by driving to work each morning). It takes more courage in my opinion to stand in the face of public scrutiny and cries of anti-patriotism and say "I believe what we are doing here is wrong, and I believe it should stop". You cannot possibly infer one's level of bravery and commitment to his fellow man from posts on a website that's famous for spamming pictures of cats and cakes your girlfriend made. It is an insult to your own intelligence (not you directly killyourfacego) to assume someone is a coward simply because they disagree with you.

Patriotism and camaraderie are too powerful recruitment tools. They prey on your sense of pride and wanting to belong, whether you own those trains because you are a good person, or because you are an insecure person, it matters not. At the end of the day many soldiers are simply emotionally manipulated into serving something that they do not understand, and by the time many of them learn what it truly is they are fighting for, their own egos and peers won't let them accept it.

I appreciate your sincere and well thought out response. I respect you and wish more people on both sides of the argument could behave like you.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points ago

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I serve my country, the US, by helping fix its education system everyday.

I sacrafice by getting paid half of what I'd get paid with my degree at a for-profit.

I was born in one of those countries that were smashed during the US's power-grabs during the cold war, I've seen and been in war. Not as a protected soldier, not as a voluntary armed adult, but as a child running with my family from bombs. Bombs that were dropped by individuals who believed they were serving their country.

[–]biskino 7 points8 points ago

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One of the things that I love about reddit is that it's always been very clear in its support of individuals who are in the armed forces. That's evidenced in numerous, 'coming home' videos, support on this site for VA hospitals and other organisations that genuinely help and serve the members of the armed forces etc. And I don't just mean supportive comments, I'm also talking about acts of material generosity from people in this community.

But by and large you'll also find redditors are smart enough to understand the difference between supporting the troops and supporting the lies, greed and power lust that sent them to two pointless wars. That person isn't in that helicopter because he was preserving anybody's liberty and using his image to perpetuate a lie deserves our contempt.

[–]frozenturkey 5 points6 points ago

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Has it really? I'm seeing dozens of posts in this thread alone that directly attack individual soldiers. I have never encountered anyone in my life who had such vitriol and scorn for the troops as what is being shown here, and in other military-related threads on Reddit. There aren't that many places, even on the internet, where you'll find people actively mocking soldiers like the young man in this photo. Reddit certainly displays far more hostility than other websites that get millions of viewers per day. From everything that I've seen in my time here, it's disproportionately hostile to both the military and individual soldiers.

It's actually one of the things that I hate about this site.

[–]dabork 25 points26 points ago*

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You know what disgusts me? Motherfuckers like you who think they know everything about everyone.

For your god damn information, there are plenty of people on this site who have served in the military or still serve. Do you think every single one of them agrees with the decisions of our military? Perhaps that's why some of them that no longer serve chose to get out.

This site gets over 10 million visitors a fucking day. You just generalized 10 million people. You know who else did that shit? Hitler (hurr durr Godwin's law) <--- For those who are retarded, this comment is a joke

Everyone has a right to an opinion, it's one of the things the people who make these sacrifices help to protect. I'm pretty sure nobody here actually thinks the kid deserved to be hurt, but to try and say he didn't sign on with these kinds of risks in mind is just retarded. Many people don't agree with the military and its senseless wars, and they have every right to do that. That's why they don't join and people who do agree with it do. It's this little thing called free will.

You have got to be one of the most pretentious twats I've ever seen on this site, and that says a lot, since I visit F7U12. Maybe if you spent less time trying to sound like some bleeding heart patriot who wants the whole world to know he cares more than they do, you'd be able to see how much of a cunt you are.

[–]bigattack 21 points22 points ago

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I believe he was referring to some of the 60 or so people who commented before him on this particular submission and not the 10 million you were referring to. Many of the comments here are quite cynical, some naive, and some, in my opinion, spot on. Whatever. I am touched by the fact that this soldier believes so much in sacrificing for others. Sure, he may not know about Halliburton, and oil, and graft and all that other shit that may make his sacrifice meaningless in some contexts. But if there were more people willing to sacrifice for those they loved and stand up and go out and DO something, the world would be better off. I wish I were more like that. I hope to teach my children to go out and try to make a difference.

[–]thethought 2 points3 points ago

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That's bullshit.

Millions of men and women have responded to the call for service put out by this country ten years ago. Not only have they eagerly joined our military, they've bolstered our intelligence agencies, gone to work in our diplomatic offices, taken up careers in security, become policemen, firefighters, doctors, nurses, lawyers, and politicians. 9/11 has changed course of thousands of people's lives.

Tens of thousands of them have been wounded since 9/11, thousands of them have perished. I suggest you take a deeper look at how eager people are to serve and protect this country before making that broad "I wish more people were like this one guy with this tattoo" because this guy is one of millions who are doing the same thing -- putting their money where their mouth is and stepping up when our country needs them.

If anything, this photo should serve as a stark reminder to this nation that every generation there are men and women ready to put their lives on the line to protect us. Some will do it out of patriotic duty, some will do it for a paycheck, and some will do it simply for the thrill, but the greater point is that millions are ready and willing to serve if need be.

As a nation, we need to be cognizant of that reality -- that our political decisions will impact the lives of millions of citizens. That the choice to deploy our military capability will forever change the lives of millions of people For some it will a change of careers, for others it will be their end, and for others it will mean carrying on without brothers, sisters, mothers, fathers, sons, daughters, nephews, nieces, etc. THAT is what is most important.

So when you look at a photo like this one and look at the substantial sacrifice this man has made, we should be asking ourselves only one thing -- was it worth it? Was it worth forever changing this one person's life for the goal we hope to accomplish?

[–]bigattack 1 point2 points ago

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I am with you. Here is what I am saying:

For every one of the people you name that have sacrificed, fought, perished, and in some other way actively contributed to a cause, not just this cause, but to any cause be it literacy, environmentalism, feeding the hungry, etc., there are 50 people who sit back and do nothing but click to the next story or at best fill out some bullshit online petition.

[–]thethought 1 point2 points ago

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Well then sir I misunderstood the underlying meaning of your post and I can say that we're in agreement. Apologies for coming off harsh.

[–]dabork -1 points0 points ago

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Doesn't matter who he was talking about. He's still generalizing about people he literally knows next to absolutely nothing about, which pisses me off to no end. It's really easy to act like you care over the internet, but how much has HE sacrificed? I understand where you're coming from, and I thank you for having such a level-headed view on the matter. This young man's sacrifice does not lose any merit, even if he was being idealistic and naive in his cause. The point is, somebody has to do the job he does, and I thank him for doing it, but that doesn't mean he's better than anyone here. There are many more things to judge a man's character on than sacrifice. If you think (not you per say) anyone in the military is automatically a great person who's fighting for all the right reasons, than you are more naive and blind than the people in this topic accuse this young man of being.

[–]digga1301 6 points7 points ago

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Did you..did you seriously just compare some dude on reddit painting with a broad brush to Hitler's genocide?

Breaking news, dabork breathes oxygen. Guess who also breathed oxygen? HITLER. dramatic music

[–]Nine99 10 points11 points ago

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Blabla...angry diatribe...

You don't know nothing about the people posting here. Just lot's of strawmen in your comment. You don't preserve liberty, you destroy it.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points ago

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I can't blame these people bro, they are simply ignorant. Reddit does have people who served, mainly POG's, with their bullshit opinions from the comfort of their DFAC. The only thing that really disgusts me is how they can just shit on a 19 year old guy who just lost so much. He'll never read any of these comments and most of these people are too big of cowards to ever confront anyone with their "opinions" but it still sick to know they are being made towards and about him. I can call some random user "fat" and get trashed and down voted to oblivion but if I decide to laugh at the turmoil of a 19 year old kid who joined the military for whatever unknown personal reason and got sent to Afghanistan only to have his life nearly taken I'm the complete voice of reason. What if this kid had no option but to join when he did? What if he doesn't do it for the glory of the red, white, and blue but to provide food for someone that's missing him back home? He nearly made the ultimate sacrifice for that loved one. Let's not think rationally though, let's type our little bullshit comments and carry on like we are intelligent people because of it. fucking hypocrites.l

[–]I_make_things 3 points4 points ago*

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Thank you for the link, and for your service.

Shit- I hope everyone reads this.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points ago

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"Consider what peace vigils against genocide have accomplished lately. Consider that there are nineteen year old soldiers from the midwest who have never touched a college campus or a protest who have done more to uphold the legitimacy of human rights and representative government by placing themselves between Iraqi voting lines and homicidal religious fanatics."

-Mark Daily

[–]randomrandomwoo 3 points4 points ago

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You ain't had shit to do with preserving liberty, and your sacrifices had nothing to do with your country. Kindly get fucked.

[–]nesatt 1 point2 points ago

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it took me about five minutes to call the European Stars office

Whoa, that's what I call technologically challenged. I wonder how you find the trigger. Just kidding, but feel free to show some hate. You seem to love that.

[–]Softcorps_dn 2 points3 points ago

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I think we are all just getting sick of how long these wars have dragged on, not to mention the cost, both in dollars and bodies, that has been paid.

Perhaps some soldiers are foolish, or idealistic, when it comes to joining the military. That doesn't mean we should treat their lives carelessly. How many more disabled vets do we need to create? How many more brothers, sisters, daughters, sons, fathers, husbands, wives, and mothers have to die overseas before someone decides that enough is enough?

[–]what-s_in_a_username 11 points12 points ago

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If soldiers were to understand the real reason they were fighting and the context within which they are fighting, they would either be absolutely furious about those who mislead them, or they would simply refuse to admit the truth because that would mean admitting they were wrong, and admitting the scale of the damage they have done while under the impression that they were right, and their ego just couldn't take it.

[–]cyberslick188 5 points6 points ago

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The latter is the majority of cases. In todays world, especially for semi intelligent soldiers, it's really hard to not notice something is a little fishy. The flow of information, even that which has been skewed, spun and downright tampered with, is simply too fast to hide.

Anyone who is even taking a half hearted look into the facts is going to know what they are doing isn't what they signed up for. The vast majority of soldiers either don't give a fuck or just close their eyes.

[–]what-s_in_a_username 0 points1 point ago

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Yeah, and it's even easier for them to not give a fuck or close their eyes if they've been trained very well to do exactly that... don't question orders, don't question anything, don't question the fact that you're a killing machine employed to kill other killing machines. It's like some sort of sick mind rape.

[–]DadWasntYourMoms1st 4 points5 points ago

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It makes me sad to think that he truly believes he's sacrificing his life for the benefit of the people he loves.

[–]atomicavox 3 points4 points ago

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I'm no expert, but it looks photoshopped on there....weird pixels when I magnify it. Not that a hard core soldier wouldn't get that type of dainty script/font tattooed on them....but yes, good message nonetheless.

[–]quattrofan 1 point2 points ago

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[–]keeganspeck 1 point2 points ago

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Pretty standard JPEG compression artifacts. Doesn't seem to be photoshopped, pretty uniform across the photo.

[–]angrysamoanstl 15 points16 points ago

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Fucking sucker. All these young kids are romanticized into believing they are heroes, when in reality they are just pawns. Wake up.

[–]Freecorbinj 1 point2 points ago

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Wake up to what, the realization that unless you were born into wealth/power, you will never amount to anything more than a means for the wealthy/powerful to become even moreso? You and I and everyone we know are pawns, so get off your high horse.

[–]Agnostix 2 points3 points ago

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Why the downvotes? This is the most truthful comment in this thread.

[–]angrysamoanstl 2 points3 points ago

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I imagine they are soldiers or family of soldiers who cant handle the truth.

[–]muuh-gnu 2 points3 points ago*

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This is a very US-centric site, and as military plays a much bigger role in the life of americans than in the life of many europeans, you will here have a much bigger opposition to criticism of war and military in general, and especially their own.

Many of them will also try to protect the perception of "dignity" of military service by furiously downvoting any kind of criticism because they consider it "offensive" and "unrespectful". American obsession with their military is somewhat similar to religion. Saying that soldiers are brainwashed pawns in a US-centric forum is similar to going to /r/Christianity or /r/Islam and saying that believers are brainwashed naive sheep. Both believers and militaristas will downvote you to hell and the tone of their responses will often imply that they would like to physically hurt you if you dared to make such an "offensive" statement face to face.

I apologize in advance to all not-brainwashed americans reading this beause I had to lump you together with all the other "thank you for your service" chanting idiots to make a point.

[–]Infuriated 1 point2 points ago

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I think it's the blatant disregard for another person's life, no matter what that person might've believed.

[–]pizzainacup 9 points10 points ago

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keep this hamfisted message shit in readers digest

[–]ImKrispy 3 points4 points ago

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another confused pawn

[–]areslion 4 points5 points ago

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Reddit, get over yourself. Its one thing to disagree with a cause, its another to call this man stupid or foolish and say his sacrifice is a waste. You know nothing of the war, or of what troops see on the ground. Turn off the liberal news for once and consider that maybe this man volunteered for service because he believed in a cause and wanted to serve his country. If the war in afghanistan/iraq was all about oil he would still fight. Because at the end of the day, you still put gas in your car to go to work. Our whole country fucking depends on that shit, and we whine like bitches at the cost of petrol, not considering our economy would shut down overnight without it. We consume that shit like water; if we ran out, who would support a war that would give us a cheap supply of water? That said, I don't really think the WOT is about oil, but if it is, that's okay too.

[–]M3nt0R 4 points5 points ago

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So it's okay to tear down the walls of another country who runs on it as much as we do (moreso on the sale of it), and just kill them so we can take it from them so we can keep our economy up?

What are we, a massive virus that just keeps spreading and consuming?

[–]Agnostix 2 points3 points ago

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If the war in afghanistan/iraq was all about oil he would still fight. Because at the end of the day, you still put gas in your car to go to work.

This is the single most idiotic pair of sentences I have ever read on this website.

[–]Rocker323 4 points5 points ago

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What is he protecting us from? I respect his motives but think they are vastly misguided.

[–]Melner 3 points4 points ago

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I can't respect his motives, too misguided.

[–][deleted] ago

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[deleted]

[–]trigonometryhappy 1 point2 points ago

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Maybe military personnel who want to come home or are against America's present foreign policy are donating...

....Read the comments under the article for one.

[–]farfromfinland 1 point2 points ago

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5 times in one thread...nice.

[–]Semilogical 4 points5 points ago

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Remind me how he is helping his loved ones? Has the USA been invaded?

[–]greenwizard 3 points4 points ago

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Maybe someone in one of the 150+ countries where the USA has military bases can answer this! Anyone?

[–]eickhardt 3 points4 points ago

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War propaganda. If you really love then you don't fight.

[–]SuperSaiyanNoob 2 points3 points ago

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Did not expect all these hateful comments. I found that picture to be inspiring.

[–]g1bb0n 1 point2 points ago

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Kids are naive.

[–][deleted] ago

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[deleted]

[–]hitlerwasright 2 points3 points ago

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He wants to bump them full of freedom pellets.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points ago

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I see the "I sit on my ass and smoke pot, but I'm all ready to judge the grunts" are out in force today.

Dude ain't the problem. Decision makers and policy people are.

[–]Mark_Lincoln 3 points4 points ago

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He must love the profit of Halliburton and the career of Obama.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points ago

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yay more blatant pro war propaganda on reddit frontpage

it's really pathetic, and i'm ashamed to have an account on this infected site, which used to be good.

[–]BeepbeepJeep1 1 point2 points ago

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Damn, he lost both his legs and an arm. He's lucky to be alive.

[–]roguent 1 point2 points ago

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What is he doing for those he loves?

[–]pbrettb 1 point2 points ago

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it is sad that these folks don't know how they are being used to kill innocents aboad, then used up and thrown away, all to serve the evil purposes of multinational corporations. there is no honour in this stupidity. "for (no valid reason) I will sacrifice (my soul, and the lives of various foreign civilians)"

[–]Grumpy_Sculptor 1 point2 points ago

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I didn't read all the way to the bottom so I don't know if someone brought up this point but the fact is some people like murder and mayhem. And a war is a perfect place to explore those feelings and actions without the threat of being put in jail. (Killing civilians aside). Man is a murderous creature and war is a long standing tradition..besides the technology what makes this war different than the war scenes described in the Iliad for example? Were a warlike race.

[–]disc0ver 1 point2 points ago

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"The winner of this tournament - no, no, the privilege - will have the honour of rescuing the beautiful Princess Fiona from the fiery pit of that dragon! Should the winner fail to return, the runner-up shall take his place, and so on and so forth... Some of you may die, but that is a sacrifice I am willing to make."

[–]Zorbotron 1 point2 points ago

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What a pointless waste of human life. I wish we didn't glorify murder and martyrdom so much.

[–]AJfromLA 1 point2 points ago

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As a member of US Army Aviation, I am honored to know that the Medevac is in our ranks.

Dustoff all the way!

[–]alragusa 1 point2 points ago

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War is old men arguing and young men dying.

[–]hawaiianrule 1 point2 points ago

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Baby Boomers had "Hell No we won't go" tattooed on them.

[–]MarkG777 2 points3 points ago

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Wow. This is a strong picture for those who serve and their families that serve with them

[–]Cyanotic911 1 point2 points ago

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Some of you people disgust me. You are taking a persons thoughts and pushing your own idea of what he is trying to say with some bullshit meaning of what he is doing and why he is doing it.

TAKE IT FOR FACE VALUE... He is there fighting with and for men he considers his brothers. He loves them accordingly. He is sacrificing with and for the brothers in arms that he loves. You guys are some real self important sycophants who are obsessed with espousing your pompous bullshit about how fucking horrible America and its people are. Go fuck yourselves and the bullshit rhetoric you preach from your damn soap boxes.

[–]terf2004 1 point2 points ago

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OH GOOD ANOTHER ONE OF THESE. HERE COME THE IRRELEVANT POLITICAL OPINIONS "OIL COMPANIES/CORPORATIONS ARE BAD" "WAR IS BAD" WHAT FUCKING INSIGHT.

[–]shawnpeps 1 point2 points ago

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Damn all those Afghanis for threatening the lives of your family!

[–]William_Faulkner 0 points1 point ago

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For the country deeply devoted to the ideals of wealth accumulation and social injustice, I will confusedly and tragically sacrifice my life.

[–]vanderbilt2014 1 point2 points ago

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It's really bothering me that all of the top voted comments on this post are trying to make a political statement. Not a single comment on this individuals bravery and courage. Show some respect to this man and the amazing sacrifice he made for this country please. I think a "thank you for your service" is more in line here.

[–]Stratocaster89 2 points3 points ago

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Quite disgusting that all the top voted comments on this post are all jokes and digs at the government/military. Theres an injured person infront of you, who obviously obviously cares about his family, and not one fuck is given.

[–]M3nt0R 1 point2 points ago

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Well, when you deal with these types of things, you're dealing with the direct physical implications (the injured person in front of you), and the symbolic implications. What does this person represent.

This is where opinions diverge. The soldier has two sides to him, and depending on which you focus, either the direct side that he probably feels, or the symbolic side behind him and why he's there, and what he's doing to other families who love their families and who are getting bombed and killed, often times as collateral damage without even being soldiers or terrorists themselves.

I'm not taking one side over the other. I feel for the soldier, but I don't feel for the war.

[–]Stratocaster89 1 point2 points ago

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Good points. I also share your view of not feeling for the war. However i'd argue this photo isnt aimed at the political side of the war at all, simply a provocative photograph displaying the sacrifices this man was willing to go through for his loved ones.

[–]brettjerk -2 points-1 points ago

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NOT FOR THOSE I'VE NEVER SEEN

[–]gmnitsua 6 points7 points ago

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Fuck everyone. Indecision is awesome.

[–]brettjerk 5 points6 points ago

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Maybe I should have clarified that this is a quote from one of the best nyhc bands of all time. But I didn't.