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lostgeneration

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This subreddit was forged about the same time the economy went to hell, lamenting the sorry state of the economy, the problems of an educated (and sometimes over-educated) young workforce having troubles finding employment despite "doing everything right", and just what this generation is supposed to do when the usual markers of adulthood (kids, house, marriage) have been pushed back in the name of higher education/income potential, along with he collective reorganization of a new set of values.

Come visit the IRC Channel! #lostgeneration

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all 152 comments

[–]shadow1515 26 points27 points ago

I mean, all you have to do is walk into a business and tell them you're looking for work. You'll have a pension plan set up by the end of the week.

That's still how it works, right?

[–]vivamiazapata 16 points17 points ago

Yeah totally! You can be anything you want to be. You could even be the president someday!

Study what you love and the money will follow!

What other lies did I leave out?

[–]mrslowloris 12 points13 points ago

Hard work is its own reward.

[–]tahudswork[S] 8 points9 points ago

Remember, work sets you free!

[–]EvilTerran 5 points6 points ago

Ouch.

[–]nullhalf2 18 points19 points ago

I only wish for our peers to have more sympathy for the people who, through no fault of their own, cannot gain livable employment. Once we recognize the problem, rather than giving blanket advice, then we can begin finding a solution to fix it. And yes it can be fixed, but we'll need everyone's help, an initiative to recognize that all human life as essential, not only practical. If we continue down the current path, the brunt force of this fallen age will eat away even up to the elite, whom I wouldn't blame for denying such a thing is happening. Pyramids cannot stand with broken foundations.

[–]reginaldaugustus 10 points11 points ago

The real question is, why do we expect everyone to have a need to find employment? With automation, we don't need a good portion of our population working, so, we, as a society, are going to have to figure out what to do with an increasingly economically useless population.

[–]nullhalf2 4 points5 points ago

We are not the society to choose for them. The individual chooses his trade on the virtues of his passion. Not too long ago this is how our system was based; it was not predatory. "Employment" is simply something done for something else (currency, bartering, it's all relevant). At the current moment, people need sustainability immediately. You must stabilize the patient before treating the wounds.

The greatest vitriol is ignorance of wisdom; I can tell you the elites are absolutely frightened or in denial. We should send them flowers, give them letters of understanding, be their friends. Only when we love them, can they love themselves and create harmony. Absolute power is a silent disease; love the man, treat the symptoms. We should pity them as well, they hold a mark on themselves.

[–]reginaldaugustus 2 points3 points ago

The greatest vitriol is ignorance of wisdom; I can tell you the elites are absolutely frightened or in denial.

No, they aren't. If they were, then they wouldn't actively be trying to make everyone else's life worse.

We should send them flowers, give them letters of understanding, be their friends.

No. There is only one thing to do to an enemy. You defeat them. You defeat them so utterly that there is no chance of them ever being a threat again.

[–]nullhalf2 4 points5 points ago

Let me put it another way. Absolute money and power are symptoms of a corrupt church. The elites are victims of a cult, indentured and born into a captivity of darkness; a world they only know. Paranoia is how they weep, denial is their bedside. You must aid them as victims, and treat them kindly, because they are created to perpetuate old ideologies against the wishes of progress and themselves.

[–]mrslowloris 1 point2 points ago

Awesome.

[–]mrslowloris 2 points3 points ago

Easy, Reggie, this guy's on a different level than that.

[–]corbin1337 -2 points-1 points ago

Actually, actively trying to make everyone's life worse is exactly what I'd expect from people who are frightened or in denial. I don't think you thought out your plan of disagreement this time.

[–]reginaldaugustus 5 points6 points ago

No, it's what people who want to make even more money do.

[–]corbin1337 -1 points0 points ago

You live in such a contrived, black and white world.

[–]reginaldaugustus 4 points5 points ago

Are you denying that rich folks want to make more money?

[–]corbin1337 2 points3 points ago

No. But you can't look past your own blinders to see that I was actually making a totally different point that might, possibly, actually strengthen your position a bit.

[–]mrslowloris 1 point2 points ago

To be fair, you agreeing with Reggie is a novel enough occurrence to be counterintuitive.

[–]some_random_chick 14 points15 points ago

Maybe you could be an astronaut, or what about A marine biologist, fuck yeah swimming with dolphins and shit. Still that's a lot of work, so now I'm thinking you should be either an nba player or sumo wrestler.

Your welcome.

[–]mrslowloris 5 points6 points ago

BOOTSTRAPS SON

[–]corbin1337 3 points4 points ago

Helps not having a bunch of children on your back to weigh you down when you're trying to pick yourself up by your bootstraps.

[–]mrslowloris -2 points-1 points ago

I'd rather be a young, poor dad than a rich, old one.

[–]corbin1337 3 points4 points ago

Then that's what you have.

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[–]mrslowloris 3 points4 points ago

What if I'm not a helicopter parent? What if I don't want to be rich?

What if I want to reduce my son's chances of having behavioral issues?

What if family is more important to me than career you soulless cretin?

[–][deleted] ago

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[–]shadow1515 10 points11 points ago

You realize that "becoming a farmer" entails acquiring an enormous amount of land and hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of dollars worth of machinery, structures, and livestock/seeds, right? Also, if you're going into it with no prior experience it's going to take a shitton of education first so you know how to actually run things. Also, small farms are being utterly raped financially these days, so it's really not a good thing to go into right now unless you already have an established family farm to take over.

[–]mattstreet 6 points7 points ago

I'm guessing he meant go work at a farm for $2 an hour...

[–]mrslowloris 3 points4 points ago

Si

[–]vivamiazapata 8 points9 points ago

But both entrepreneurship and farmland require a large capital investment. If someone can't get a job they can't get capital.

If I had 150k I know exactly what business I would start.

And not everyone wants to be an entrepreneur, even if they did have capital. Working 50-60 hours per week in exchange for a 401k plan, health insurance and a steady paycheck is more appealing to many people.

[–]rwilcox 4 points5 points ago

I would say that even some kind of knowledge work (be that computer programming, business consulting or teaching), you really need a few months worth of expenses saved up for the lean times, when you don't have clients or are between client payments. So probably at least 5 figures saved up.

If you actually had to buy something - lease on a retail space, etc... then yeah "large capital investment"

[–]vivamiazapata 6 points7 points ago

Five figures is a large capital investment to most people.

[–]mrslowloris 0 points1 point ago

So much moneys

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[–]mrslowloris 5 points6 points ago

I've never been offered 40k a year so I can guarantee you that hasn't happened. Are you just here to brag about your bank accounts? Dick move.

How much money did your parents have?

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[–]mrslowloris 3 points4 points ago

What's that, like, upper middle class, middle middle class? Do you think their income has anything to do with your ability to be lackadaisical about amounts of money that, to someone who perhaps grew up in less affluent surroundings, might seem like an awful lot? Or do you think your success is purely a result of your guile and will?

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[–]tahudswork[S] 21 points22 points ago

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahah... Seriously? I mean, you are joking right? I should start a business with what capital? Selling what? Myself? That's about all I've got. Also, I should start a business because everyone knows those don't go bust, especially if you have no experience in starting/running a business! What a great idea! Thank you, if only anyone here had thought of that, why, we could all have jobs!

As for being a farmer... you know that honest to god family farmers are getting squeezed out faster than a turd at a taco bell, don't you? Furthermore, unlike them I wouldn't be starting with thousands of acres of land and multi-hundred thousand dollar machines already purchased. It'll be me, a shovel and my backyard. What could possible go wrong!

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[–]rwilcox 11 points12 points ago

As a professional computer programmer, let me weigh in:

I spent 2 years during high school learning to program after school. I started consulting part time during my freshman year of college for a local programming consulting shop. The first year or two at that job I knew very little (looking back on things now), struggling to learn the trade. I'm glad my employers were OK with that.

Fast forward 4 years, and I started my own consultancy business out of college. Doing computer programming consultancy is hard: in addition to having technical chops you also have to do project management, manage cash flow, deal with clients who fight you about money, know basic accounting, you name it. In my own practice there were a lot of years that were "famine" years, and only a few that were "feast" years.

So maybe you think that you can get a job as a programmer with a startup, because startups are what everyone thinks about now. In my experience you need two things going for you to get a job at a startup: 1) living in SF or NYC and 2) having 2-3 years of professional experience in their language of choice. If you don't have both of those things the pickings are pretty slim.

The thing about startups is because the team size is so small they can't (or don't think they can) deal with bringing on a newbie programmer and the slower output they will have.

Please don't do DevBootcamp or CodeAcademy and think that you can put our your consultancy shingle, working for clients directly. If you really want to go that route find a more experienced freelancer to subcontract with for a year or two, and learn from them.

In one way, the world of web development is easier than the programming world I grew up in (writing C and C++ programs for desktop computers), and perhaps with laser focus on web development you could be a good developer in 6 months. HungryAcademy thinks it can train people to do that, and I have seen amazingly talented people go far with very little (comparatively) training. Then again, there's at least 4 languages to any moderately complex website (CSS, HTML, JS, and a server-side language), so there's a lot to cover.

But certainly it's not a matter of just picking up "Learn Web Development in 24 hours" and a day later being able to charge clients $100/hour for websites. Your looking at half a year at least, if not 2 years at least before companies take you seriously. And probably 3 or 4 years before you really should be taking on clients yourself.

So sure -- certainly if your unemployeed and looking to get an edge up and make a long-term investment in yourself (or just learn something fun!) maybe spending 10-30 hours a week learning programming (between job searching) is a good idea. Maybe in 6-12 months you can make something interesting that people like or think shows enough potential that they're willing to take a chance on you. But it's not a panacea.

[–]vivamiazapata 0 points1 point ago

Are you hiring? I know desktop programming.

[–]mrslowloris 0 points1 point ago

HTML 5 looks sooooo juicy, might be able to cut JS out soon.

[–]mrslowloris 2 points3 points ago

Have you made any money on it?

[–][deleted] ago

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[–]mrslowloris 0 points1 point ago

What languages?

[–][deleted] ago

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[–]mrslowloris 2 points3 points ago

Cool! I studied writing but no one wants bad English translated into good English. :\

[–]corbin1337 0 points1 point ago

That actually would be cool. Hard to make I bet, but it'd see use by students and professionals to shore up their essays and emails.

[–]mrslowloris 0 points1 point ago

I've wondered how long it will be until google translate starts to offer functionality to translate between dialects and not just languages. I have a feeling class differences could be minimized if resources were available in a more vernacular format.

[–]vivamiazapata 0 points1 point ago

Where are the classes?

[–][deleted] ago

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[–]vivamiazapata 0 points1 point ago

You rock! I've done desktop application programming, but never web stuff. Web programming is a fantastic skill to have.

[–]eleitl 2 points3 points ago

I should start a business with what capital? Selling what? Myself? That's about all I've got.

That's quite enough. Ever heard of consulting?

Also, I should start a business because everyone knows those don't go bust, especially if you have no experience in starting/running a business!

What is the problem? Incorporating is really cheap e.g. in Nevada. If you have no running costs failing doesn't cost you anything extra.

[–]mrslowloris 6 points7 points ago

Just be a consultant! What planet are you from?

[–]eleitl 3 points4 points ago

Europe, IT cluster. But I'm pretty handy in the lab, too.

If you think there's no work for SAP or IT in general I beg to disagree.

[–]mrslowloris 1 point2 points ago

Oh great, another arrogant STEM.

We got like four people just like you on this board already, what are you bringing to the table?

[–]eleitl 3 points4 points ago

arrogant STEM

I've never known scanning tunneling electron microscopes to be that.

what are you bringing to the table?

I'm just trying to figure out how truly lost you are. So far I see quite a lot of learned helplessness, but then, I'm not in your shoes.

I've lived in three countries though, including US, and I left US for a damn good reason. I think my advice for a young USian to get the fuck out, while there is still time. Because it's not going to get better.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points ago

Problem is your advice to "Start a business!" is predicated upon "Have a highly useful skill that people are willing to pay for!" Telling the people here who graduated with history degrees to start their own business or become consultants because the IT sector is doing fine is useless.

[–]eleitl 1 point2 points ago

If you have a useless degree you have to throw away everything and be prepared to start from scratch.

Case in point: I have a degree in chemistry, and work in IT. Entirely unrelated fields.

[–]vivamiazapata 0 points1 point ago

I have a masters degree in IT and work in fast food. These are also entirely unrelated fields. It looks like you folks in Europe are doing much better than us Americans.

[–]mrslowloris 3 points4 points ago

For some of us it's never been any better.

[–]corbin1337 -2 points-1 points ago

You're spot on about the learned helplessness. This entire subreddit thinks the world is against them and they have zero power until jobs get thrown at them.

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[–]tahudswork[S] 18 points19 points ago

As someone who is on his second graduate degree, this time in education, and working full time, abet at a shit 'not real' job, fuck you. Fuck you in the ass you worthless piece of shit. If self-confidence and self-esteem were all that's needed to make a business successful why every freshman sports marketing major would be a billionaire. So again, fuck you.

[–]jcpuf 10 points11 points ago

lol redditors aren't customers, you entitled shithead.

[–]eleitl -3 points-2 points ago

So you make a difference in your attitude, depending whether someone is a potential customer, or an employer?

If yes, you're a fucking snake. And it's obvious, and that is why you can't get a job.

Fix your attitude first.

[–]jcpuf 4 points5 points ago

No, nobody owes you anything. The idea that if you're a customer, service employees owes you bowing and scraping, is shitty. And the idea that you can then extend your customer-hood to everyone in order to obligate everyone to respect you, is shittier.

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[–]pip-squeak 4 points5 points ago

Reddit: the place where strangers try to win over strangers

[–]GiraffeManny 8 points9 points ago

Troll poster is a troll. Back to /r/investing you 1%-er wannabe fuckhead. Hustle your way into an early grave why don't you.

[–][deleted] ago

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[–]pip-squeak 7 points8 points ago

Try harder

[–]mrslowloris 2 points3 points ago

Get out of this subreddit.

[–][deleted] ago

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[–]pip-squeak 4 points5 points ago

I think you're confusing your luck in life with skill.

[–]eleitl -1 points0 points ago

If you think skills don't change your chances you've just fell into a trap of your own making.

[–]pip-squeak -2 points-1 points ago

try harder to not make spelling mistakes.

[–]eleitl -1 points0 points ago

How are your spelling skills in your other foreign languages?

[–]pip-squeak -1 points0 points ago

congrats, you win!

[–]mrslowloris 0 points1 point ago

Something unethical, perhaps?

[–][deleted] ago

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[–]tahudswork[S] 6 points7 points ago

Thanks for the insightful content setting me straight as to how the real world works. I sure know more now than I did before you commented! /Sarcasm

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[–]theawesomeishere 7 points8 points ago

Ignorant about what? The huge profits to be had as a farmer, or the limitless business ventures a recent graduate without experience or capital has at their fingertips?

[–]mrslowloris 1 point2 points ago

The real world maaaan.

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[–]vivamiazapata 2 points3 points ago

I would be willing to bet this was before 2007.

[–][deleted] ago

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[–]vivamiazapata 0 points1 point ago

That's interesting. What do you do and when did you start?

[–]pip-squeak 3 points4 points ago

Make a job and pay yourself. It sounds so simple. Why haven't I thought of that.

[–]eleitl -2 points-1 points ago

It's called starting a business, and it's a lot of work actually. HTH, I'll be here all week.

[–]theawesomeishere 2 points3 points ago

Cool story bro. Why doesn't everyone just make $350k a year? People are just stupid, I guess.

[–]tahudswork[S] 5 points6 points ago

Your stating something does not make it true or convincing. To be frank you sound like a stoned asshole. Barely coherent and vapid.

[–][deleted] ago

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[–]tahudswork[S] 5 points6 points ago

So you know that there are 'endless' jobs in IT in the US? Great! I'll let all the out of work people I know about them. Also, are you employed in IT right now? I'm just wondering because your spelling/punctuation is very dodgy and I was under the impression those things matter in programming.

[–]Ortus 1 point2 points ago

And if the market is that bad, who is gonna buy from his business? If he wants to be a farmer, where will he find land?

[–]reginaldaugustus 4 points5 points ago

What a hilariously stupid idea.