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47
48

A controversial cartoon depicting an Agnostic. (imgur.com)

submitted ago by [deleted]

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[–]JustWanderful 3 points4 points ago

Where is the deism pool?

[–]rkyeun 9 points10 points ago

Deists stand on the first rung of the ladder into the theistic pool with only their ankles wet.

[–]thyhorrorcosmic 2 points3 points ago

Nicely put

[–]humanity23 -1 points0 points ago

I like the comparison. But deism IS one of the four types of belief according to Dawkins.

[–]rkyeun 6 points7 points ago

Deism is a philosophy which holds that reason and observation of the natural world, without the need for organized religion, can determine that the universe is the product of a creator. According to deists, the deity seldom, if ever, intervenes in human affairs or suspends the natural laws of the universe.

They believe in god. They go in the theist pool.

They don't use organized religion. They get to go in the shallow end.

They use science and reason. They get to keep their heads above water.

[–]dirtknapp 2 points3 points ago

Behead all those who insult indecisiveness.

[–]reese_ridley 3 points4 points ago

...maybe

[–]Bobthemightyone 2 points3 points ago

I like it because the "can't know" ring is closer to where he's jumping from

It shows that it's a farther leap to say for sure god exists or doesn't exist.

[–]triplaur 1 point2 points ago

As an Agnostic, I love this.

[–]yourfrigginguide 1 point2 points ago

but which one are you?

[–]ikinone 0 points1 point ago

Because it illustrates your indecisiveness?

[–]WeaponsGradeHumanity 0 points1 point ago

Surely if something is controversial then nobody needs to point that out to anyone.

[–]ReyTheRed 1 point2 points ago

Not exactly controversial. Also not entirely accurate. You can't land in between theism and atheism, but you could land (painfully) on the concrete.

[–]yourfrigginguide 2 points3 points ago

That would probably be the cognitive dissonance

[–]ikinone 1 point2 points ago

It's a cartoon... It serves to make a point unless you simply want to be pedantic.

[–]ReyTheRed 0 points1 point ago

I do enjoy my pedantry.

[–]dmzmd 0 points1 point ago

Mu

[–]Koncur 0 points1 point ago

This just in, emotions which may or may not have been anger have been sparked by a cartoon mocking agnostics. Today, hundreds of agnostics couldn't decide which embassy they should or shouldn't protest in front of, nor whether or not they should get violent about it.

[–]Deledestile 0 points1 point ago

I can't decide whether this is a cartoon which is trying to show that even if one declares agnosticism, they are still bound to end up as either an agnostic atheist or an agnostic theist, or if this is supposed to be showing the false dichotomy of theism and atheism as two pools, contrasting it against the agnostic who can simply refuse to swim.

Either way, it reminds me of the little infographic which crops up here on /r/atheism condemning agnosticism to be simply an adjective descriptor for either atheism or theism. I personally dislike this sentiment. I think that it's perfectly possible to hold a purposeful suspension of belief in a subject for lack of information.

[–]3DBeerGoggles 3 points4 points ago

I think the problem is that by definition, agnosticism is a statement regarding knowledge (or in this case, a lack thereof), while atheism\theism is a statement regarding belief.

I'm at the point where I prefer to point at the "Dawkins Scale of Theistic Probability" and ask people where they feel they fall on the scale.

[–]Deledestile 0 points1 point ago

Exactly, agnosticism isn't even a statement that we CAN'T know if a god exists, only that we DON'T. If you were to ask me if I thought it more or less probable that god exists, I would just say "I don't know."

[–]ikinone 3 points4 points ago

I can't decide whether this is a cartoon which is trying to show that even if one declares agnosticism, they are still bound to end up as either an agnostic atheist or an agnostic theist

That's it.

showing the false dichotomy of theism and atheism as two pools, contrasting it against the agnostic who can simply refuse to swim.

How is diving at solid ground 'refusing to swim'?

I think that it's perfectly possible to hold a purposeful suspension of belief

A suspension of belief is atheism. I guess you don't want to associate with that label because you either like to think of yourself as more open minded than other people or you have a friend or relative who is religious and you do not want to offend them, or you were raised religious and have a hard time considering a stance which you previously considered would lead you to hell.

[–]Deledestile -2 points-1 points ago

Why do you have to dive at all? That's what agnosticism is. I don't believe that there is no god. Neither do I believe that there is a god. So instead of diving in the pool of theism or atheism, I will go and run around on the grass of experimentation and empirical study, never committing to swim in either pool.

Also, I take exception to your attempt to analyze my beliefs. It would be so much simpler to say that I am just afraid to come down as an atheist because I might offend someone or that I might be trying to be pretentious about it. Your assertion is simply an ad hominem fallacy, trying to lump me in as some sort of straw man to appease your assumption that agnostics are just pretentious or politically correct atheists. I take it as an insult that you would make such an uninformed and incorrect assault on my background as a reason for my beliefs.

No, I am an agnostic because I do not know whether or not a god/gods may exist, and I refuse to make a statement of belief either way. I simply have no way of analyzing the probability that a deity might exist. Atheism is an active disbelief in any deity. I just don't have that.

[–]ikinone 1 point2 points ago

Why do you have to dive at all? That's what agnosticism is.

Not diving is not an option. There is nothing in the cartoon that indicates the guy is not going to dive. Why would he be up there to begin with? You are welcome to draw your own cartoon that you think better represents your stance, but stop trying to draw a strange and desperate conclusion from this one.

I don't believe that there is no god. Neither do I believe that there is a god.

That is exactly what most atheists believe.

I will go and run around on the grass of experimentation and empirical study,

That is exactly what most atheists support.

never committing to swim in either pool.

That is what the 'don't know for sure' section is for. You are in the atheist pool already, you just don't want to admit it, probably for one of the reasons I mentioned.

Also, I take exception

I honestly don't give a fig.

It would be so much simpler to say that I am just afraid to come down as an atheist because I might offend someone

That is covered in what I said.

Your assertion is simply an ad hominem fallacy,

Not at all. I am not saying that those properties make your argument wrong. I have provided other reasons for that. These reasons are simply the reasons which drive you to take that stance to begin with. Stop trying to wriggle out of this by throwing around Latin phrases and misleading.

agnostics are just pretentious or politically correct atheists.

That is exactly what they are.

I take it as an insult that you would make such an uninformed and incorrect assault on my background as a reason for my beliefs.

Good. It seems you need a bit of insulting, though you probably just want attention anyway.

No, I am an agnostic because I do not know whether or not a god/gods may exist,

Again - still potentially atheism.

Atheism is an active disbelief in any deity.

That is a misconception on your part. Even prominent atheists like Dawkins do not have an active disbelief. You are simply ignorant.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spectrum_of_theistic_probability

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